Parts: Belatedly Discovered Junk

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spiffy
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Parts: Belatedly Discovered Junk

Post by spiffy » Fri Sep 22, 2006 7:54 pm

* "New" rubber and cloth fuel lines that crack a year later.
Ask for German Choline.
Beware when purchasing.

Italian Weber Rebuild Kits.

(Colin-edit 03/15)
Royze Carburetor Kits, check very closely for correct hole indexing, drill holes out to make sure they line up with intended carburetor passage.
78 Riviera "Spiffy"
67 Riviera "Bill"

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DurocShark
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Post by DurocShark » Mon Jan 22, 2007 4:08 am

Brazillian Aux Air Elbows. This one was purchased and installed last August:

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DurocShark
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Post by DurocShark » Sun Jun 10, 2007 6:20 am

Napa Echlin brand fuel injector seal kits. $2.44 per injector, and out of 4 boxes, one of the large seals came with a crack.

Plus, all were skinnier than the originals in my bus. The injector clamp was ALMOST big enough to slip past the large seal.

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Post by vdubyah73 » Mon Mar 23, 2009 4:54 am

I've seen talk somewhere of using a 90* spark plug wire boot to replace that piece. Silicone, heat resistant.
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never owned a gun. have fired a few.

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whc03grady
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Re: Parts: Belatedly Discovered Junk

Post by whc03grady » Wed Sep 11, 2013 3:00 pm

Royze rebuild kits for Solex 32-34 PDSIT

The top gasket does not line up with the screw holes very well and (worse) the void for the float is too small, meaning the float can get hung up on it, flooding the carb and everything downstream.
Ludwig--1974 Westfalia, 2.0L (GD035193), Solex 34PDSIT-2/3 carburetors.
Gertie--1971 Squareback, 1600cc with Bosch D-Jetronic fuel injection from a '72 (E brain).
Read about their adventures:
http://www.ludwigandgertie.blogspot.com

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Amskeptic
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Re: Parts: Belatedly Discovered Junk

Post by Amskeptic » Sat Sep 14, 2013 4:42 pm

whc03grady wrote:Royze rebuild kits for Solex 32-34 PDSIT

The top gasket does not line up with the screw holes very well and (worse) the void for the float is too small, meaning the float can get hung up on it, flooding the carb and everything downstream.
Let's keep going!
The needle valves often do not seat correctly, causing crankcase floods.
The mixture screw seals can snap in half when trying to stretch them over the screw.
Base gaskets can be so mushy that they block the passages at the bottom of the carb
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,660 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 206,845 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 121,400 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,570 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 92,435 miles

kreemoweet
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Re: Parts: Belatedly Discovered Junk

Post by kreemoweet » Mon Sep 01, 2014 1:06 am

Mechanical fuel pump rebuild kits (original VW part no. 111-198-555, for the 1300/1500/1600 VW/Pierburg "square top" pumps).

I acquired a couple of those old pumps and tried to use my kit from Wolfsburg West to rebuild one of them, with the following findings:

(1) the new cutoff valve diaphragm/seat simply would not seal. Inspection showed that its sealing disk was placed too far from the seat in the pump body.

(2) the main pump diaphragm material is downright flimsy compared to the original stuff.

(3) the pull rod attached to the main diaphragm is too short, by about 4 mm. This makes it virtually impossible to install the diaphragm with the correct 14 mm preload on the pump lever. This also causes the diaphragm spring to be compressed further than it ought to be, resulting in excessive pump pressure.
I measured 28 mm from the flat area on the underside of the diaphragm to the fiber/plastic washer on the end that the operating lever contacts, whereas the correct distance seems to be about 31.5 mm.

(4) the metal plate on the underside of the kit diaphragm lacks a proper spring seat, as the originals had. The spring end must fit sloppily on a sloped area raised up off the central flat area. This will also cause a small extra compression of the spring.

(5) the original metal spring seat/cup and two-piece nylon pull rod bushing have been replaced with a single cheesey slotted plastic piece.

(6) the diaphragm spring (which is the main determinant of pump output pressure) was stiffer than the originals - again, a defect resulting in excessive pump pressure.

The parts from the two original pumps, and from two NOS better-quality rebuild kits I have, had none of the deficiencies noted above.

All-in-all, I would have zero confidence in the proper operation or reliability of a pump
rebuilt with one of these kits. Nevertheless, these pieces-o'-crap kits are being sold for around $35.00 by some vendors.

Here's a post from theSamba by someone trying to install one of these kits: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewto ... 7&start=0.

It seems he/she eventually gave up and got an electric pump.

EDIT (3 Sept., 2014): I attempted to replace the delivery valve seat in one of the old pumps I'm trying to refurbish, and discovered that that the seat in subject kit has a diameter of 19.10 mm, whereas the originals are 19.55 mm. Again, these kits seem to be a complete fraud.

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hambone
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Re: Parts: Belatedly Discovered Junk

Post by hambone » Thu Mar 12, 2015 11:56 am

I had the excess fuel pressure issue when I rebuilt my pump 6 years ago. A stack of gaskets fixed it. I also reused many of the existing parts. Seems to run OK. I used whatever Brazilian kit was available.
Is there a decent rebuild kit out there? I just can't justify 200 bucks for a pump.
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http://pdxvolksfolks.blogspot.com
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Amskeptic
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Re: Parts: Belatedly Discovered Junk

Post by Amskeptic » Thu Mar 12, 2015 2:36 pm

hambone wrote:I had the excess fuel pressure issue when I rebuilt my pump 6 years ago. A stack of gaskets fixed it. I also reused many of the existing parts. Seems to run OK. I used whatever Brazilian kit was available.
Is there a decent rebuild kit out there? I just can't justify 200 bucks for a pump.
Worst part of it, Hambone, I had to supply my own pump. This guy knows exactly what is going on. I would have rather rebuilt it myself, just order a diaphragm kit from him for $15.00, but the spare diaphragm is not available until you get the whole kerschnizzle. I am doing it, because if my hot desert runs are cured of the flooded starts, it will easily save me $200.00 in prematurely destroyed rings and cylinder walls, no other way around it. This will be my first carbureted air-cooled Volkswagen with the correct factory engineering at the pump. I look forward to it as a scientist, as a desperate owner of soon to get pissed off rings and cylinders, as a stock Schnotzi, and it will allow me to set a fire under Wolfsburg West's lazy butts to start bitching at their supplier, in fact, this letter went out just hours ago:
Subject Header: Craptastic Rebuild Kits?

Description: FUEL PUMP REBUILD KIT, complete, all 1200-1600 cc pumps with slip style fittings
Part # Price Qty. In Stock
111198555 $28.00

********************************************************************

I have been hearing nothing but horror stories about incorrect length of diaphragm link, too strong of a spring causing horrendous fuel pressure, incorrect dimensions, etc.

I want you to know and understand, that I just paid close to $200.00 to have VintageWerks of Salt Lake City rebuild my fuel pump so at least I might have some recourse against the Shoddy Casade Of Crap that threatens to ruin our beautiful cars.

I would have happily paid YOU! for a $50.00 rebuild kit if the damn thing had any sort of quality. When are we going to *communicate* with our suppliers/manufacturers and shame them into stepping up their game?
Right now, everybody loses so some cynical outsourcer can laugh all the way to the bank.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,660 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 206,845 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 121,400 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,570 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 92,435 miles

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wcfvw69
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Re: Parts: Belatedly Discovered Junk

Post by wcfvw69 » Fri Mar 13, 2015 4:37 pm

Colin-

Pls share what response (if any) you receive from Wolfsburg West. All of us would love to hear their response.

BTW, I've started to avoid WW when I can find the same part else where due to their horrific "live" customer service you recieve when you have to call them. It's almost breath taking how socially inept they are on the phone. The employees who answer the phone have zero personality, interest in what you're doing or anything resembling friendliness. They come across arrogant, short, quick and to the point. You couple this with some of the crap (like this kit) they continue to sell and it's a deal breaker for me.

I've spent over $1k elsewhere in the last couple of months due to their employees shitty attitudes while the answer the phone. This happens every time I call them for a part. Whoever own Wolfsburg West needs to address this issue before everyone tires of it and goes where people at least ACT like they appreciate the $ I'm spending with them.
1970 Westfalia bus. Stock 1776 dual port type 1 engine. Restored German Solex 34-3. Restored 205Q distributor, restored to factory appearance engine.

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Amskeptic
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Re: Parts: Belatedly Discovered Junk

Post by Amskeptic » Sat Mar 14, 2015 7:55 am

wcfvw69 wrote:Colin-

Pls share what response (if any) you receive from Wolfsburg West. All of us would love to hear their response.

BTW, I've started to avoid WW when I can find the same part else where due to their horrific "live" customer service you recieve when you have to call them. It's almost breath taking how socially inept they are on the phone. The employees who answer the phone have zero personality, interest in what you're doing or anything resembling friendliness. They come across arrogant, short, quick and to the point. You couple this with some of the crap (like this kit) they continue to sell and it's a deal breaker for me.

I've spent over $1k elsewhere in the last couple of months due to their employees shitty attitudes while the answer the phone. This happens every time I call them for a part. Whoever own Wolfsburg West needs to address this issue before everyone tires of it and goes where people at least ACT like they appreciate the $ I'm spending with them.
Many of the Volkswagen parts vendors are suffering from Diminishing Volume. This has got to ruin their sleep, and I dare say their attitude at work.
Like the relentless hell of nature under those peaceful dripping ferns, Hambone! species go extinct all the time and the usual individual extinction scenario is painful starvation or getting eaten by some asshole who managed to evolve stronger than you. What is different between:

"Go AWAY, you uglyass dingo, I am surprised your kind ever got to mate."
"No, you are my lunch."
"I don't want to be your lunch, I am far nicer than you, way prettier, too."
"Are you done now?"
AND
"Go away, you GEX marketing monstrosity, I am surprised you are still in business."
"No, they like my engines."
"I think they are CRAP. MY engines are more reliable and way prettier, too."
"Are you done now?"

I have around twenty counter visits at Wolfsburg West. There is a friendly younger guy and a somewhat sharper older guy who I think is a) sad to watch the thing slowly die, and b) annoyed as hell at the numbers of clueless customers who come in "dude, you got lowering kits?" "what year and model?" "Oh, man, I don't know, it's a bug, I thought you would know."

I am cranky and relentless at the counter, you should have seen the Chloe turn signal lens fiasco, but we all understand each other at the end. I'll send along an anonymous tip about their customer service.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,660 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 206,845 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 121,400 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,570 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 92,435 miles

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wcfvw69
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Re: Parts: Belatedly Discovered Junk

Post by wcfvw69 » Sat Mar 14, 2015 12:29 pm

Amskeptic wrote:
wcfvw69 wrote:Colin-

Pls share what response (if any) you receive from Wolfsburg West. All of us would love to hear their response.

BTW, I've started to avoid WW when I can find the same part else where due to their horrific "live" customer service you recieve when you have to call them. It's almost breath taking how socially inept they are on the phone. The employees who answer the phone have zero personality, interest in what you're doing or anything resembling friendliness. They come across arrogant, short, quick and to the point. You couple this with some of the crap (like this kit) they continue to sell and it's a deal breaker for me.

I've spent over $1k elsewhere in the last couple of months due to their employees shitty attitudes while the answer the phone. This happens every time I call them for a part. Whoever own Wolfsburg West needs to address this issue before everyone tires of it and goes where people at least ACT like they appreciate the $ I'm spending with them.
Many of the Volkswagen parts vendors are suffering from Diminishing Volume. This has got to ruin their sleep, and I dare say their attitude at work.
Like the relentless hell of nature under those peaceful dripping ferns, Hambone! species go extinct all the time and the usual individual extinction scenario is painful starvation or getting eaten by some asshole who managed to evolve stronger than you. What is different between:

"Go AWAY, you uglyass dingo, I am surprised your kind ever got to mate."
"No, you are my lunch."
"I don't want to be your lunch, I am far nicer than you, way prettier, too."
"Are you done now?"
AND
"Go away, you GEX marketing monstrosity, I am surprised you are still in business."
"No, they like my engines."
"I think they are CRAP. MY engines are more reliable and way prettier, too."
"Are you done now?"

I have around twenty counter visits at Wolfsburg West. There is a friendly younger guy and a somewhat sharper older guy who I think is a) sad to watch the thing slowly die, and b) annoyed as hell at the numbers of clueless customers who come in "dude, you got lowering kits?" "what year and model?" "Oh, man, I don't know, it's a bug, I thought you would know."

I am cranky and relentless at the counter, you should have seen the Chloe turn signal lens fiasco, but we all understand each other at the end. I'll send along an anonymous tip about their customer service.
Colin
Yes, it's very clear that there is a deminishing volume in the classic, air cooled VW parts business. As a result, you'd think an astute VW parts business owner would clearly identify this while reviewing monthly revenues and financials. You would then review your entire business model and look for areas of improvement to insure you were not turning off the remaining pool of VW customers who need to spend their VW parts money somewhere. Most business people who have a customer service business, understand that when the phone rings, there's someone on the other line waving money, looking to spend it. They then TRAIN their staff's to "sell" their products to said customer and "wow" them so much that they'll want to call back in the future to spend more money. It's really not THAT hard a concept! People have complained about WW's poorly trained "sales" people who are the face of their business, for years. Yet, nothing has been done by their ownership to address or correct this glaring issue. That's poor management/leadership in a nut shell.

I've trained many, many inside sales people over the years and have seen first hand the impact of friendly, helpful and engaged sales people have had on repeat business, increased volume, revenues and customer satisfaction. By in large, Americans are tiring of shitty customer service, rude, poorly trained employees and mediocre products. Yes, the VW parts vendors as a whole, suck in most of these areas though I've seen some recent "hope" for the future. After my last call to WW to inquire about what brand a part was and was left shocked at how terrible the "sales" person was, I called another vendor who had the brand of part I was searching for. He was friendly, helpful, conversational and get this... he took the time to THANK me for chosing them (I placed my order) and asked me to call him again next time I needed a part! There is hope!!

We are seeing more and more where more and more VW parts vendors are being called out on The Samba for their shitty customer sevice or parts (cough, German Supply). The vendor feedback thread there has been helpful for many to warn of companies like that while also PRAISING the very good vendors who do bend over backward to provide good products and excellent service. I'm VERY quick to take the time to post in those threads, especially when I get great service.

We all need to continue to be more and more vocal and share our experiences with vendors and parts whle holding them accountable with our dollars. We've seen lots of VW businesses go down in flames due to this very fact.
1970 Westfalia bus. Stock 1776 dual port type 1 engine. Restored German Solex 34-3. Restored 205Q distributor, restored to factory appearance engine.

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Amskeptic
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Re: Parts: Belatedly Discovered Junk

Post by Amskeptic » Sun Mar 15, 2015 10:12 am

wcfvw69 wrote: We all need to continue to be more and more vocal and share our experiences with vendors and parts whle holding them accountable with our dollars. We've seen lots of VW businesses go down in flames due to this very fact.
w-h-i-l-e I will go down in flames because I spell-check my customers and forum members alike :bom:
Colin

(I am on the side of accountability . . . we do all of us a disservice if we do not hold usselves accountable)
u-s-s-e-l-v-e-s :cherry:
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,660 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 206,845 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 121,400 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,570 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 92,435 miles

kreemoweet
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Re: Parts: Belatedly Discovered Junk

Post by kreemoweet » Tue Feb 16, 2016 9:57 pm

Yet Another Bogus Fuel Pump being offered.

This one is from CIP1, their part #VWC-113-127-025-DOE. It seems to be from the low-end "Classic Aircooled" line of JP Group (Jopex, Dansk, etc) of
Denmark. The only marking on the pump is a logo showing the letters "PN" with "wings". The liars and fraudsters at CIP1 would have you believe it is "OEM Quality", but don't you fall for it!

It's an imitation of the VW/Pierburg round-top mechanical fuel pumps used on VW busses up to 1970, among others.

The casting had numerous nasty burrs and snags all over: unpleasant to look at, and even more unpleasant to handle, due to their sharpness.
The lever shaft has no circlips, but the body has an extra bump into which the knurled end of the pin is driven. This may or may not solve the typical pin loosening of aftermarket fuel pumps, but it also makes it impossible to substitute an original pin with circlips. The lever itself is of strange construction: 4 flat "leaves" held together with a couple of pins. The lever on the pump I got would not center inside the body and insisted on
riding over to one side and rubbing on the inside of the casing. This seems to be a new low in imitation fuel pump mechanical design.

The pump diaphragm is also of unique design, being pentagonal. There are, of course, 5 mounting screws instead of the usual 6. The lower
flange actually has 10 holes, but only 5 have been tapped. Bizarre!

The diaphragm assembly is hard to compare directly to original design, there being several small differences from original, but suffice it to say
it gave excessive output pressure immediately. The diaphragm spring, unlike any I've seen before in a similar device, did not have its ends ground
flat. Another telling sign of shoddy manufacture, I'd say.

I really don't get this almost invariable excessive pressure thing with aftermarket pump makers. What is it about "not to exceed 5 psi" that's so
difficult to understand? All they have to do is use a lighter spring: that's what I did with this one and got the output pressure down to 4.5 psi.

The top cover has a sizable hex bolt to tighten it down against the cheezy, somewhat coarse, plastic mesh filter and rubber seal ring. There's nought but an aluminum washer under the bolt head, which refused to seal for me. I added a "rubber" washer under it and got it to seal, but it seemed to me a quite excessive amount of tightening was required to make the seal there and at the rim gasket.

The pump has brass in&out fittings, 5.85 mm OD, with an actual barb at the tip. The upper inlet fitting has an arrow, showing the correct
direction of flow. That's a plus in my book!

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Amskeptic
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Re: Parts: Belatedly Discovered Junk

Post by Amskeptic » Fri Feb 19, 2016 6:32 pm

kreemoweet wrote:Yet Another Bogus Fuel Pump being offered.

This one is from CIP1, their part #VWC-113-127-025-DO. It seems to be from the low-end "Classic Aircooled" line of JP Group (Jopex, Dansk, etc)
I have had only painful experiences with Jopex / Dansk, especially their hideous Type 4 heat exchangers and Type 1 mufflers with the welded heat riser pipes so you can't move the damn flanges to meet your specific engine's width. They have turned me off of all of Denmark.

Watch out for loosening brass nipples when you have to muscle the hose off. I would mandate that you cut the hose longitudinally and replace the hose every time. You do NOT want to loosen the brass nipples.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,660 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 206,845 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 121,400 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,570 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 92,435 miles

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