Tommu Engine Re-Re-Rebuild

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tewa3240
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Re: Tommu Engine Re-Re-Rebuild

Post by tewa3240 » Sat Jul 14, 2018 5:10 pm

tommu wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 11:41 am
This is a brass bore brush that snapped off at the thread of the adapter threads as I was pulling it out of the gallery while cleaning the case in detergent. The threads are just inside the gallery - too far down for a pair of pliers and too precarious for me to try anything brutal like an EZout.

Image

The case is currently with an Engineering Discharge Machining specialist for removal. The hope is they can spin of the threaded adapter from the brush and then use a new threaded rod to pull the brush out. The way this is all going.. we will see :shaking:

This is what you can see:
Image
And this what the brush itself looks like
Image
I would try a wet/dry vac on it, or a straw & my own suction, : O or some 10 minute quick-cure 'Right stuff' silicone on a nail to try & tug it out.

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tommu
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Re: Tommu Engine Re-Re-Rebuild

Post by tommu » Sat Jul 14, 2018 7:09 pm

tewa3240 wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 5:10 pm

I would try a wet/dry vac on it, or a straw & my own suction, : O or some 10 minute quick-cure 'Right stuff' silicone on a nail to try & tug it out.
If only it were that loose. JBweld was going through my mind before I took it to a shop..

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Re: Tommu Engine Re-Re-Rebuild

Post by Jivermo » Sun Jul 15, 2018 3:08 am

Man, Tommu, I feel for you. Agonizing, every step of this process. This grit ordeal is just mind numbing. Thanks for posting your continuing work; it’s a real education.

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asiab3
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Re: Tommu Engine Re-Re-Rebuild

Post by asiab3 » Sun Jul 15, 2018 4:12 pm

Damn Tommu, I’m just now reading of this whole ordeal... You sound like you’re still motivated and making good progress; excellent!

100psi of compressed air in the next bearing’s oil gallery should pop that brush out but good.

Keep it up!
Robbie
1969 bus, "Buddy."
145k miles with me.
322k miles on Earth.

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Amskeptic
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Re: Tommu Engine Re-Re-Rebuild

Post by Amskeptic » Sun Jul 15, 2018 6:25 pm

tommu wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 4:32 pm
And here's the latest example of devastation that grit or glass bead can do to an engine:
That's a gouge in the valve stem I can feel with by finger. It's been caused by grit trapped between the valve stem and the adjusted screw. I emailed Len for advice and he recommended lash caps. A sensible solution but it really sticks in the throat to need them on a new head. Am I being fussy if I think about paying for new valves? I need to take a close look at the screws too. I bought OEM VW adjusting screws and will be pissed if I need to replace them too.

The lesson here is not to let anyone bead blast your pushrods for you. Or anything else that goes near the inside your engine. It's devastating.

Tell it. Tell it. We're done with people who take shortcuts to make things look "pretty", HAH? We're done with this stupid "convenience", YAAH? I have been hating on sand-blasters and silver paint on aluminum parts since forever.

So yeah, now I gots to tell you to chill a little with the big nasty reaming brushes getting brutally stuck in your delicate galleries. You heard/read me mention to you to be clean clean clean, but there is such a thing as going too crazy. Tearing up gallery bores leaves its own aluminum shards. GumOut spray and paper towels gave me this. It now has 27,000 miles:

Image


GumOut spray and paper towels gave me 169,000 miles on this:

Image


I have never used reaming brushes ever. Settle down. Be gentle. Be thorough.
Colin :cyclopsani:
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

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tommu
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Re: Tommu Engine Re-Re-Rebuild

Post by tommu » Sun Jul 15, 2018 8:21 pm

asiab3 wrote:
Sun Jul 15, 2018 4:12 pm
100psi of compressed air in the next bearing’s oil gallery should pop that brush out but good.
Hey Robbie, I trust everything's good with you. It didn't budge with 175PSI. Good advice for someone who might think to use brass bore brushes - is not to use them :lol:

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tommu
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Re: Tommu Engine Re-Re-Rebuild

Post by tommu » Sun Jul 15, 2018 8:22 pm

Amskeptic wrote:
Sun Jul 15, 2018 6:25 pm
I have never used reaming brushes ever. Settle down. Be gentle. Be thorough.
Colin :cyclopsani:
That lesson is learnt.

Lash Caps. Any advice? I understand I will need to shim the rocker stands to match. How about pushrods? Will they be too short now?

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Amskeptic
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Re: Tommu Engine Re-Re-Rebuild

Post by Amskeptic » Mon Jul 16, 2018 6:17 am

tommu wrote:
Sun Jul 15, 2018 8:22 pm
Amskeptic wrote:
Sun Jul 15, 2018 6:25 pm
I have never used reaming brushes ever. Settle down. Be gentle. Be thorough.
Colin :cyclopsani:
That lesson is learnt.

Lash Caps. Any advice? I understand I will need to shim the rocker stands to match. How about pushrods? Will they be too short now?
This is a tough call. If you have intact perimeters on your stem tips, I would use elephant foot adjusters. They have great surface area, no swiping motion (easier on the guides!), but require that you grind the bottoms of the rockers at the adjusting screws .055" and I recommend a countersink to help the swivels articulate in peace. I love my Heiko (theSamba) swivelfoot adjusters.
Ask Len if he blesses this solution. I did NOT shim the rocker stands or affect the geometry in any way. I did switch to 17mm locknuts which I like a whole lot better than the skinny 14mms. (see page 11)

https://www.thesamba.com/vw//forum/view ... a6a0109a81

Image


I cannot find the stupid write-up on Itinerant Air-Cooled that showed the dremelling of the rocker arm bottoms for that nice countersink.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

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Bleyseng
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Re: Tommu Engine Re-Re-Rebuild

Post by Bleyseng » Mon Jul 16, 2018 7:08 am

Yep, real swivel foot adjusters are the way to go. Much quieter too
Geoff
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70 Ghia vert, black, stock 1600SP,- 139,000 miles,
76 914 2.1L-Nepal Orange- 160,000+ miles
http://bleysengaway.blogspot.com/

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tommu
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Re: Tommu Engine Re-Re-Rebuild

Post by tommu » Mon Jul 16, 2018 11:06 pm

Len concurs so I shall use Swivel foot adjusters. I have some 1.7 rockers that can take 8mm adjusters - but I am not seeing why I shouldn't use the German 10mm ones?

Do I need to consider shortening my pushrods?

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Amskeptic
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Re: Tommu Engine Re-Re-Rebuild

Post by Amskeptic » Wed Jul 18, 2018 8:20 am

tommu wrote:
Mon Jul 16, 2018 11:06 pm
Len concurs so I shall use Swivel foot adjusters. I have some 1.7 rockers that can take 8mm adjusters - but I am not seeing why I shouldn't use the German 10mm ones?

Do I need to consider shortening my pushrods?

Use the Heiko 10mm adjusters. Then you can have the 17mm locknuts.

You would actually *lengthen* your pushrods to match the longer adjustment screws to maintain the perfect geometry. That would then also require shims under the rocker stands. Then, everybody (pushrod, rocker shaft, adjusting screw) is out an equal amount and the angles are exactly the same.

However, I was able to tuck the swivelfoot adjusters into the rocker arms with my patented countersink, and did not have to do any of that. It was literally plug-n-play.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

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tommu
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Re: Tommu Engine Re-Re-Rebuild

Post by tommu » Fri Jul 20, 2018 5:55 pm

I was recommended Caltron in Burbank to remove the stuck bore-brush. Caltron’s the owner boasted about his contract with the Jet Propulsion Lab and the aviation business generally. They claimed to be the specialist in removing studs, bolts etc. They seemed the perfect people to remove an awkward but not impossibly stuck brass bore brush from blind oil gallery. It seems that they were not. Some ass got so frustrated with this damn bore brush that they used a drill straight down into the oil gallery. They didn’t even take the time to check angle of approach and took a chunk out of the gallery to number 4 main bearing. It’s very hard to get a decent photograph of the damage - I think this video will help show how dismal it all is:

https://youtu.be/iEQIaM_KDyI

So it looks like this case is ruined. Money time and energy squandered. I don’t know where to go from here.

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Amskeptic
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Re: Tommu Engine Re-Re-Rebuild

Post by Amskeptic » Fri Jul 20, 2018 9:21 pm

tommu wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 5:55 pm
Caltron’s owner boasted about his contract with the Jet Propulsion Lab and the aviation business generally. They claimed to be the specialist in removing studs, bolts etc.
They took a chunk out of the gallery to number 4 main bearing. It’s very hard to get a decent photograph of the damage -
So it looks like this case is ruined. Money time and energy squandered. I don’t know where to go from here.

First, call Caltron. Ask to speak with the owner. Explain your predicament with the gallery.
Demand a refund.
Tell owner that we all on theSamba/IAC/Everywhere are watching this saga with great interest because some of our members work at Cal Tech and JPL high up in the hierarchy. Name drop Michael Watkins.

Then use the case after cleaning it carefully. You may have a little extra oil flow to #4, so keep those bearing clearances low.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

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tommu
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Re: Tommu Engine Re-Re-Rebuild

Post by tommu » Fri Jul 20, 2018 9:43 pm

Amskeptic wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 9:21 pm
tommu wrote:
Fri Jul 20, 2018 5:55 pm
Caltron’s owner boasted about his contract with the Jet Propulsion Lab and the aviation business generally. They claimed to be the specialist in removing studs, bolts etc.
They took a chunk out of the gallery to number 4 main bearing. It’s very hard to get a decent photograph of the damage -
So it looks like this case is ruined. Money time and energy squandered. I don’t know where to go from here.

First, call Caltron. Ask to speak with the owner. Explain your predicament with the gallery.
Demand a refund.
Tell owner that we all on theSamba/IAC/Everywhere are watching this saga with great interest because some of our members work at Cal Tech and JPL high up in the hierarchy. Name drop Michael Watkins.

Then use the case after cleaning it carefully. You may have a little extra oil flow to #4, so keep those bearing clearances low.
Colin
I met the owner, he was apologetic and didn't charge me. Just so disappointing that another company just can't bring themselves to take every job seriously.

I am relieved and a little surprised this case will work. I'll carry on cleaning. Just not with brass brushes...

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tommu
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Re: Tommu Engine Re-Re-Rebuild

Post by tommu » Fri Jul 20, 2018 10:01 pm

https://i.imgur.com/v6fOKNp.jpg

This - do I carefully make sure there are no raised edges. Using a razorblades if necessary?

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