Stock Oil Pump Size?

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blue72beetle
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Stock Oil Pump Size?

Post by blue72beetle » Sun Jun 25, 2017 7:52 pm

What is the stock oil pump size for a 71 Bus 1600? I've read 21mm and I've also read 26mm. Can't find a definitive answer.
I'm building an all stock (aside from being 1776) engine for my bus and getting frustrated with the lack of stock-mindedness over on the samba. Why does everyone suggest low quality parts or parts they 'think' are better than what VW designed?

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Amskeptic
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Re: Stock Oil Pump Size?

Post by Amskeptic » Sun Jun 25, 2017 9:49 pm

blue72beetle wrote:
Sun Jun 25, 2017 7:52 pm
What is the stock oil pump size for a 71 Bus 1600? I've read 21mm and I've also read 26mm. Can't find a definitive answer.
I'm building an all stock (aside from being 1776) engine for my bus and getting frustrated with the lack of stock-mindedness over on the samba. Why does everyone suggest low quality parts or parts they 'think' are better than what VW designed?


You are a person after our own hearts here.

Stock '71 Bus dualport 1600 and doghouse cooler was 26mm and required the dished four-rivet cam.

If you set your bearing clearances to the tighter side of the specification window, you will have good oil pressure for a long time.
Colin
(people suggest what they have in stock, what they are familiar with, what they were told, what they could afford, etc)
BobD - 1978 Bus . . . . . . . . . . . 112,660 miles
Chloe - 1970 bus . . . . . . . . . . . 206,845 miles
Naranja - 1977 Westfalia . . . . . 112,885 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,570 miles
Alexus - 1991 Lexus LS400 . . . 78,899 miles

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sgkent
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Re: Stock Oil Pump Size?

Post by sgkent » Mon Jun 26, 2017 11:08 am

Stay with stock or as close as you can, and your problems will be generally minimized. As to the oil pump - the actual pump depends on the type camshaft gear. A mismatch can cause a disaster. Show a photo of your pump and the cam gear here before you assemble the new engine. If the engine is together then photo the gear with the pump out. The amount of dish determines the pump body size, and depth of the driven gear. There is also a limit on how far it sticks out because of the engine mount mustache bar on a stock 1600 dual port.
Thank You -

Merlin The Wrench

Machine Work/Shop Recommendations: http://kentcomputer.com/77VW/machinework.pdf

Pointers on rebuilding an engine: http://kentcomputer.com/77VW/rebuilding_a_vw_engine.pdf

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blue72beetle
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Re: Stock Oil Pump Size?

Post by blue72beetle » Mon Jun 26, 2017 1:30 pm

I'm planning on getting this:
26mm oil pump:
http://vwparts.aircooled.net/Schadek-26 ... 07akhd.htm
Cam w/ gear:
http://vwparts.aircooled.net/Stock-Cams ... 9-021d.htm

They say it works with a 3 or 4 bolt cam gear. I'm planning on getting the 3 bolt version, my thinking is that if I need to change out the gear due to cam gear backlash, then 3 bolt gears are more common.

Maybe i should start a thread on my engine build so I can show everything I've got and ask any questions there.

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sgkent
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Re: Stock Oil Pump Size?

Post by sgkent » Mon Jun 26, 2017 3:28 pm

the dished cam looks like this. http://vwparts.aircooled.net/Stock-Cams ... 9-021g.htm Talk with John and be sure you get the right pump for the cam. The flat cam was up to 1971. The dished cam was 1971.

The difference is which oil pump the engine will take. A pump for a 3 bolt will not fit a 4 bolt dished cam. Ask me how I know. The tang on the end is a different length.
Thank You -

Merlin The Wrench

Machine Work/Shop Recommendations: http://kentcomputer.com/77VW/machinework.pdf

Pointers on rebuilding an engine: http://kentcomputer.com/77VW/rebuilding_a_vw_engine.pdf

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asiab3
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Re: Stock Oil Pump Size?

Post by asiab3 » Mon Jun 26, 2017 10:37 pm

Steve- it came as news to me, but the new Shadek pumps that aircooled.net is selling actually do fit dishes and flat cams. The guide for the drive tang is long enough, and the tang long enough, that you can press the tang in or out of the pump gear to fit either style. That just about saved my bacon in Colorado when my flat (3-bolt) cam was taken out, and a dished (4-bolt) cam was donated to me. Same pump, plus a hammer and punch, Rich Parker's work bench, and I was set to proper pump/cam interface once again.

blue72beetle, is this the engine that we talked about you building when I was in Ft. Wayne last year? Please excuse my lack of reply on The Samba.. a new job has been kicking my ass.

Robbie

PS- I have a NOS Shadek of Germany 26mm 4-bolt "deep" pump available. PM me if you want it.

PPS- DO NOT BUY the $50-$60 lifters from aircooled.net. Ask me how I know ;)
1969 bus, "Buddy."
142k miles with me.
319k miles on Earth.

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sgkent
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Re: Stock Oil Pump Size?

Post by sgkent » Tue Jun 27, 2017 9:23 am

Robbie - I rebuilt my 1971 once, and the pump did not sit deep enough in the dished cam so it lasted about 700 miles before it spun out. Fortunately I was looking right at the oil light when it happened and my instinct from being involved in racing so much was to instantly kill it and clutch so the engine went from 3600 RPM and no oil to stopped. There was no damage to the bearings, and the right oil pump fixed it quickly. In those days the body and the driven gear were forged / machined as one piece. That said, Changing the depth of the shaft on the gear does change the wobble of the gear. I measured the change on the T-4 pumps I was working on trying to get the most stability I could from them during the blueprinting process Phil put them thru for me.
Thank You -

Merlin The Wrench

Machine Work/Shop Recommendations: http://kentcomputer.com/77VW/machinework.pdf

Pointers on rebuilding an engine: http://kentcomputer.com/77VW/rebuilding_a_vw_engine.pdf

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