used head - is this one usable?

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asafk
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used head - is this one usable?

Post by asafk » Sat Jan 30, 2016 9:29 am

Hi,

the left head on my 2.0FI engine needs replacement. It was assembled by PO with too many wrong things around this job, and I was using it for several thousands km knowing its time is about to come.
the main issue over this part of the world is finding a decent 2.0 oval port head - as it is a very rare engine. so I was looking around for several months, and finally came around a used head that seemed good enough to buy on spot.
from afar it does look fine, something that can be prepared by replacing valves and that kind of stuff. but when I have cleaned and examined it this is what I saw on #3 :
head 3.jpg
:pale:

needless to say - on any other situation I wouldn't use this head. but being practical, I don't have anything else.
what would you recommend - is there a way to put this head into service, or should I wait some more until I can get hold of a better head? I'd hate to do a bad job, but just as well, I may wait weeks or months until I'll find another used head.

many thanks in advance..

Asaf,

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Re: used head - is this one usable?

Post by Jivermo » Sat Jan 30, 2016 11:34 am

Man, that looks pretty chewed up. Can't you import a good set of heads from maybe England? Are there many busses in Israel? Just Kampers has type 4 heads; maybe worth a call +44 (0)1256 862288. Why do all the labor, and risk more engine damage and expense, with a questionable part?

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dingo
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Re: used head - is this one usable?

Post by dingo » Sat Jan 30, 2016 11:47 am

first of all..clean it up till it shines...then inspect for cracks....sand off rough edges..clean again...i use a dremel and wire brush
finally do the water test for leaks...then you can advance to next step
'71 Kombi, 1600 dp

';78 Tranzporter 2L

" Fill what's empty, empty what's full, and scratch where it itches."

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Amskeptic
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Re: used head - is this one usable?

Post by Amskeptic » Sat Jan 30, 2016 3:06 pm

asafk wrote:Hi,
from afar it does look fine, something that can be prepared by replacing valves and that kind of stuff. but when I have cleaned and examined it this is what I saw on #3 :

[attachment
I would not have a problem using that head if it passed the valve seat/spark plug thread/exhaust stud, valve guide bore test.

The chewed up surfaces do need to be smoothed, but do not go for a polished surface. Try to made an edge between the quench area and the combustion chamber bowl that somewhat matches the other combustion chamber. The important thing here is no little edges that can promote pre-ignition.

Then perform a CC volume test on the cylinder and go make all the other combustion chambers match it, quench/combustion.
If you find that you cannot get them to match (the more likely scenario being that the repaired combustion chamber has more CCs than the others) , you may add a cylinder sealing ring to the other side of the engine, but you cannot add just one sealing ring to the companion on this side of the engine. In that case, divide the difference between damaged + companion and make that number the CCs for both chambers on the other side of the engine.
Colin
BobD - 1978 Bus . . . . . . . . . . . 111,155 miles
Chloe - 1970 bus . . . . . . . . . . . 206,820 miles
Naranja - 1977 Westfalia . . . . . 104,650 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,570 miles
Alexus - 1991 Lexus LS400 . . . 78,885 miles

asafk
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Re: used head - is this one usable?

Post by asafk » Sun Jan 31, 2016 11:20 am

many thanks, all.
I'm a bit cheered up now..
I will go further with examination and then we'll see.

Asaf.

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Amskeptic
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Re: used head - is this one usable?

Post by Amskeptic » Sun Jan 31, 2016 3:24 pm

asafk wrote:many thanks, all.
I'm a bit cheered up now..
I will go further with examination and then we'll see.

Asaf.
Let us know what you find, and if you need help with getting combustion chambers equal, fly me to Israel. I have always wanted to visit.
Colin
BobD - 1978 Bus . . . . . . . . . . . 111,155 miles
Chloe - 1970 bus . . . . . . . . . . . 206,820 miles
Naranja - 1977 Westfalia . . . . . 104,650 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,570 miles
Alexus - 1991 Lexus LS400 . . . 78,885 miles

asafk
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Re: used head - is this one usable?

Post by asafk » Mon Feb 01, 2016 11:56 am

Amskeptic wrote:
asafk wrote:many thanks, all.
I'm a bit cheered up now..
I will go further with examination and then we'll see.

Asaf.
Let us know what you find, .
Colin
will do.
Amskeptic wrote: fly me to Israel. I have always wanted to visit.
heads or no heads.. you're always welcome.. :king:

Asaf.

asafk
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Re: used head - is this one usable?

Post by asafk » Sat Feb 20, 2016 11:31 am

Hi,

I'm back.

not finished yet, this is what it looks like now:
HEAD_3.JPG
much better, isn't it?
should I try to make the edge between quench and combustion more... edgy? I don't want to lose too much material.

looking better on #4, it has some pitting, but other than that I have examined the head and it looks good.

Asaf.

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Amskeptic
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Re: used head - is this one usable?

Post by Amskeptic » Mon Feb 22, 2016 6:51 am

asafk wrote:Hi,

I'm back.

not finished yet, this is what it looks like now:
HEAD_3.JPG
much better, isn't it?
should I try to make the edge between quench and combustion more... edgy? I don't want to lose too much material.

looking better on #4, it has some pitting, but other than that I have examined the head and it looks good.

Asaf.
Make it more edgy only as you equalize volumes, otherwise, run it.
ColinIn76*MiamiAndLovingItEatYourHeartsOutNortheasters
BobD - 1978 Bus . . . . . . . . . . . 111,155 miles
Chloe - 1970 bus . . . . . . . . . . . 206,820 miles
Naranja - 1977 Westfalia . . . . . 104,650 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,570 miles
Alexus - 1991 Lexus LS400 . . . 78,885 miles

ainokea
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Re: used head - is this one usable?

Post by ainokea » Thu Mar 10, 2016 9:12 pm

If possible change the exhaust valves for new. whatever you decide to do, you should at least lap the valves into the seats. one last thing before installation, might be a good idea to lap the cylinders into their respective contact surfaces in the heads. Ainokea

asafk
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Re: used head - is this one usable?

Post by asafk » Sat Apr 22, 2017 4:54 am

after too long, an update.
exh. valves and guides replaced, head fitted, valves adjusted, engine tuned,
then because of some bureaucratic crap i had to wait for almost a year to get the bus insured and on the road (don't ask). about a month ago I did a short test run, then re- adjusted the valves (didn't sound right and i found that one nut indeed got loose).
then a long test run to the desert - on a cold day, 300km each way, kept it easy (not more than 55-60 mph cruising), oil temps were perfect, about 100 most of the time and not exceeding 100-110 degC on hills.
I did hear some exhaust puffing out, so i re-torqued the exhaust manifold - two nuts were a bit loose.
then some three weeks ago we took the camper for a long trip - 12 days from Tel Aviv up north to mt. Hermon (about 1200m above sea level), then to the Golan heights, the sea of Galilee (210m below sea level), the Galilee, the Jordan valley, up to Jerusalem (750m above sea level), and down to the Dead sea (400m below sea level), then up to the Negev mountains (1000m above sea level) and all the way down to the shore of Eilat, and back to Tel Aviv... 1100 miles total, not going too fast, going slowly uphills, keeping on the correct gear to keep oil pressure up and temps down. the engine worked perfectly, I did have to add some oil after climbing to the Hermon, but that was it engine wise.
So... I'm happy with the result - and thank you all for the good advice.

Asaf.

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asiab3
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Re: used head - is this one usable?

Post by asiab3 » Sat Apr 22, 2017 3:37 pm

Congrats Asaf! Thanks for keeping us in the loop; it's nice to know that problems do get resolved positively under trying circumstances.

Enjoy the roads!
Robbie
1969 bus, "Buddy."
119k miles with me.
296k miles on Earth.

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Amskeptic
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Re: used head - is this one usable?

Post by Amskeptic » Sun Apr 23, 2017 5:13 am

I think VW engines respond well to careful attention and a little love. I am heartened that your heads are behaving. I need to ask much the same of my little Chloe engine currently touring Florida with me in NaranjaWesty.
Colin
BobD - 1978 Bus . . . . . . . . . . . 111,155 miles
Chloe - 1970 bus . . . . . . . . . . . 206,820 miles
Naranja - 1977 Westfalia . . . . . 104,650 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,570 miles
Alexus - 1991 Lexus LS400 . . . 78,885 miles

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