upd Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Oregon

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upd Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Oregon

Post by Amskeptic » Sun Jun 24, 2018 11:30 pm

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After the delightful heat that was mine, that I earned, by driving from Eureka CA to Redding CA, to enjoy that lovely drive up I-5 (yes, I said "lovely") into Oregon, I had to sadly wend my way back to that icy icy Pacific coast on a beautiful road by name of OR 42. Showed up in Coos Bay at sunset and washed the car in a car wash that was perfectly situated to accept all onshore winds straight through the bay. Imagine, if you will, the spray reflecting off NaranjaWesty like some episode of "Deadliest Catch", I was surely to catch my death of sniffles.

Camped along US 101 across from some huge pulp mill. Then it rained. I woke up to rain. Drove to my Seventy3Bus call under hideous morning clouds and mist. We dove into a successful day of valve adjustment, breaker points, timing, and I don't think we ever even touched the carburetion.

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We did, however, re-pack all four CV joints, right side Rein, left side Lobro. It's a long-term test.

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Then, we went on an al fresco test drive better which to experience the cursed cold, yes, but more importantly, to experience the delicate fragility of a VW chassis sans doors or windows. Delicate:

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Now, because we did not get through the list as far as we had hoped, I offered to build up a door in the morning while Seventy3Bus was at work. Seventy3Bus is an officer in the Coast Guard. He is a Get It Done sort of guy. I planned to Get it Done. But nooooo. The stupid stupid little vertical front vent window seal just would not go into the groove. It just wouldn't. The vent window was flipping and flopping every which way, and every time I had to press, it would slip and slide around. After an eternity, I got it started in the groove, but alas, it would not slide up the channel so I could snug it securely in the corner. Guess what I was using? I was using "Simple Green", the same minty sauce that tormented me with Bookwus' windshield installation. When I realized that the time was slipping away, I got too irritatedly physical, and my screwdriver slipped off the channel and landed blade-edge-first on the edge of the vent window. It exploded all over the interior of NaranjaWesty.
All Over.
My frantic-ness settled into a deadly rage quiet. I have so had it with poorly-fitting aftermarket parts (edit - 06/22 and I just DID a VW Audi seal just yesterday with Ich Bin Kurt that slid in as per usual with no fuss). Very furiously did I carefully shake all interior contents upon the floor and carefully brushed them and set them outside, until I had just a crumbly pile of broken glass to pick up. Then I mopped my carpeted floor with Gorilla Tape strips to pick up the shards from the carpet. Very thoroughly, I picked up every discernible shard in the interior with strip after strip of tape. Repacked the interior. Hated on the seal. Tried again. Nope. The seal just would not stay in the groove long enough to allow the other side to get stuffed into its groove. Repaired to the parts bus and pulled its vent window. Fashioned an Itinerant Air-Cooled vent "window" out of cardboard for the parts bus and miserably apologized to everything in sight, including my bleeding fingertips:

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We did manage to get the seal in together at his lunch break, and the other one too, and we did manage to get the door hung before I had to apologetically escape to Maupin for the DeschutesRiverRendezVW:

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Showed up in TheDalles in mid-afternoon. I love this part of the country, this Columbia River Gorge leading to the midlands of Oregon:

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This whole clockwise 2018 Itinerary was to get to Maupin by Father's Day weekend. Parked on the lower quarter with my fellow riff-raffs, Ruckman101, asiab3, ShawnHigh, vistacruzer, Emo (?) and many other carousers:

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Always a pleasure to hear a flawlessly running 1600 even if I am about to get air-schooled:

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My pretty years are sooo behind me:

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What I did was take a lap of the campground every morning and evening and yack it up with many people whose names I couldn't keep straight. In the morning, I preyed upon the hospitality of all to please contribute an inch of coffee to my paper cup. Then I would have a full cup by the end of my solicitation drive. During one of these laps (laps, it's what I do), I met Patricia and her bus which was running poorly, popping and spitting. The invoice she showed me made no sense. What distributor "can't exceed 25*"? Competitive nature thus sparked, I went down to the lower quarter and rallied my Riff-Raff Compatriot in Volkswagen Redemption .. .. .. :

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.. .. .. and we set about trying to disprove that invoice. And we did. In four minutes flat. It was just another case of "leaking EEC Valve diaphragm takes away the vacuum advance."

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Whilst timing the engine with the EEC hose plugged, I noted that the flash of the timing gun would disappear at high rpm. Patricia told me that bucking and sputtering syptom was attributed by the mechanic to "bad gas". I attributed it to the Pertronix, and asiab3 rustled up his supply of breaker points and condensor and wire plug holder, and we showed Patricia how to gap points and install a distributor and guess what, campers? It runs smooth.

The music was good, the dogs divine:

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I am so embarrassed that I never did stop and chat with our very own Ronin10 and family! That is Oscar in the middle of the picture, the green Westy I am working on tomorrow in Seattle:

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We had a good contingent of Vanagons, including the famous 2008 cylinder head repair Vanagon and its owner Gary:

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We of the Riff-Raff Lower Quarter stayed up pretty late both nights, but it was so good to see all of these people! You MUST get to the 2019 DeschutesRiverRendezVW. WE must. This is the way back to Hood River:

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Chased a Vanagon. It won on the uphills:

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Had an excellent evening at the LuckyLab with many of the people who were just at the DeschutesRiverRendezVW.
Hambone was there with Ma, one of the great inspirations for me to persevere and get an early bay, and there is Bertha, ruckman101's steed to the left, another great honest early bay bus :

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Asiab3 was there with Buddy The Totally Subtley Tricked Out LED Festooned Bus (ask about the reverse lights):

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Speaking of tricked-out:

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(Stuart, defying gravity since forever)
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Shawnhigh surprised me at the Lucky Lab on Monday night with the last thing I needed for NaranjaWesty. He told me it will probably be all restored and on within two days. Shawn, thank-you! and it was 42 hours:

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(test fit and hole drilling)
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paint stripping and metal bending)
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(sanding and washing)
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(on the car one hour before the rains)
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Will fill in later! Geesh, too many pictures. 71whitewesty and Ich Bin Kurt write-ups to come.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,660 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 206,845 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 116,898 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,570 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 84,465 miles

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Re: Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Oregon

Post by Amskeptic » Mon Jun 25, 2018 11:04 am

Oregon and Washington residents may be a bit blase about all of those volcanoes yonder, but I am from New York, 'there's volcanoes yonder!" They add a real exotic garnishment to the landscape:

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I was flying around like a fly in a bottle over the past week. Coos Bay Maupin Hood River Portland Maupin Hood River Portland Seattle and today? Spokane, about 50 miles west glorying in the low population density. Here's an Interstate 84 along the Columbia Gorge:

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So, somewhere on this forum, wait a sec .. .. ..

viewtopic.php?f=42&t=13392&start=75#p229565

.. .. .. ^ here, we had a vexing issue with a bus that did not want to idle. I was rarin' to figure this out, at my very favorite Bus Bazaar plus Buddy:

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Of course, it was not easy to keep them straight. What we discovered whilst working on Bus # 001wh71pt in the course of the initial diagnosis was that the idle timing was 16* ATDC even though the centrifugal timing was set at a perfectly acceptable 28*BTDC @ 3,400 rpm. Now, I have always said, "the high rpm timing is key, don't worry about the idle timing." Guess there's a limit to that. We could not glean any obvious reason why the stupid retard unit would knock the timing back so far, it has a limit stop, the limit stop was stopping. The circumstance dictated that we merely disconnect the retard hose, plug it, and set the idle to a nice normal 900-950 rpm with no retard, duh.

"So, what changed that caused this horrific retarded timing to render the engine un-idle-able?" Glad you asked. The engine only has a couple of hundred miles and it has a lot of draggy friction from the new rings and bearings, etc. I am of the mind that once the engine breaks in and loosens up, the idle is going to creep too high and the idle air screw won't be able to screw in enough. Ergo! Stick the retard hose back on then.

We also knocked out a few piffles, like fix the horn and the mid-level sliding door roller which had an odd separation of the pulley:

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Midday shot of the scene. We disassembled the rear brakes of the 1972 here to your right and checked for adequate fuel hoses. Funny enough, after we did a test r&r of the late model air filter on this 1972 (a bit of a fiddlefest), the very last operation we did was to try to tidy up the harnesses and wires that drifted about the engine compartment. As we trimmed the idle speed and prepared to sign off this vehicle's trip to Yellowstone in a few days, I was suddenly drenched with a full jet of fuel. Apparently . . . . I . . . . did not secure the clamp on the hose to the cold start valve. Yeah, so there was that. People (Colin), Pay Attention At All Times:

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Drove to Maupin to give Mark of DeschutesRiverRendezVW fame a morning of electrical troubleshooting on Clementine the bug. It was challenging to keep all of the wiring diagrams straight in the breeze. From Maupin, it was back to Portland to work with Ich Bin Kurt and his 1969 Sportmobile. Arrived late and had to look for a poorly-lit campsite in the gritty scrum of Portland.
Found it.
Here's a new one to add to the Places I Have Camped . . . in a row of crashed cars at a beat down auto body shop off Killingsworth:

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Now, I had also set up a pizza date with Hambone & Fam, so I was quite sure that I would blow out of the appointment early. Therefore, we needed to be especially productive in the 8 1/2 hours allotted. As Kurt disassembled the clutch system from pedal to release lever, I cut apart his wiring harness at the right rear and attempted to restore his brake/tail/license/reverse lights.
He got the smooth clutch action:

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I barely got the lights to work with my hair-trigger penchant to wrap up a whole new harness without testing *every* wire. :

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Then, I disassembled the turn signal switch and actually pulled off a solder job on the dimmer switch ground wire:

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So, at 3:00PM, "let's rebuild the passenger door." It was here that I was painfully reminded that a VW/Audi vent window seal indeed does install with light lubrication and a thumb press/slide to insert it into the groove . . . unlike that Coos Bay disaster of shattered glass and too-thick rubber squirming out from under my every effort.

The new VW/Audi vent window seal required us to dremel out each drain hole that was sealed with rubber flashing, six or so in all. Here, I have blasted the hole with a small screwdriver in preparation for the conical Dremel stone:

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Did we finish the door in time for me run off and socialize? No. But I did give a full day . . . hey Kurt, how did it go?
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,660 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 206,845 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 116,898 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,570 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 84,465 miles

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Re: Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Oregon

Post by Ich Bin Kurt » Mon Jun 25, 2018 6:34 pm

"Did we finish the door in time for me run off and socialize? No. But I did give a full day . . . hey Kurt, how did it go?
Colin"
busses.jpg
Hey Colin...thanks again for your visit. Things went pretty good. I will start out with the only real "bad" news: Our fancy dimmer switch repair didn't last even until the next day when I took a test drive. Unfortunately the ground connection we(you) so valiantly reconnected must have come loose on the first good turn? Not only that but they are stuck on high beam...how rude. We also somehow "fixed" the turn signal lever so it won't stay on when you apply...now you have to manually hold until your turn is finished or you are really sure nobody is behind you...egads. Perhaps I need to continue looking for a replacement switch? Also my horn still blares when I turn real slow or parallel park so I must still have a ground in the horn wire somewhere?

Good news is I took a ~200 mile drive up and over Mt Hood yesterday and the clutch action was superb. Who knew the clutch pedal bushing needs grease?
clutch.jpg
As far as the rest of the door seal installs the 2 remaining felt channels seem to install good. I did have to reinstall the bigger main one a couple times as for the life of me I couldn't get the lower grey "bracket" on the lower outer door to reinstall unless I removed the felt channel first. It turns out the felt channel runs/sits directly into the channel on the grey bracket and trying to install with the felt channel was not going to happen. The hard part about removing and reinstalling this felt channel is the angry sharks tooth "clips" that hold the larger chrome windows scraper molding/seal in place takes giant bites out of the felt channel each and every time I removed or install. So tread carefully here. So I of course need to finish the vapor barrier and install the new main outer door seal itself...AND THEN do the Drivers Side door. But look at the fancy Dynamat I installed in the doors. Now when you close the door I get a nice solid thud instead of a loud tinny echo chamber...yay! Safe Travels Colin...see you on the flip side in 2019. -Kurt
Vent pic.jpg
old seals.jpg
full door pic.jpg
p.s...If anyone is interested here is a pic of the VW/Audi Vent window seal(231 837 465) that Colin effortlessly installed in seconds(literally). I got this along with the door seal kit from Bus Depot.
vent window seal.jpg

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Re: Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Oregon

Post by Amskeptic » Mon Jun 25, 2018 10:47 pm

Ich Bin Kurt wrote:
Mon Jun 25, 2018 6:34 pm
Our fancy dimmer switch repair didn't last even until the next day when I took a test drive. Unfortunately the ground connection we(you) so valiantly reconnected must have come loose on the first good turn? Not only that but they are stuck on high beam...how rude. We also somehow "fixed" the turn signal lever so it won't stay on when you apply...now you have to manually hold until your turn is finished or you are really sure nobody is behind you...egads. Perhaps I need to continue looking for a replacement switch?
I think we can get the indicator function back with a careful disassembly to look at that wire. Check the self-cancel tab on the switch. It may have the sprung-free-wire globbing it up? Could we screw that wire in place or pinch it against the housing with a little paperclippish clip? I think it just goes on the switch metal wherever you can find room.

Ich Bin Kurt wrote:
Mon Jun 25, 2018 6:34 pm
Also my horn still blares when I turn real slow or parallel park so I must still have a ground in the horn wire somewhere?
Ach, there goes my Samba buyer/seller review. Remember how the green wire/hose clamp is attached to the column tube? And how I saw that circlip loose? And how I thought the loose circlip might be grounding sporatically? I would check that when the switch is away from the tube so you can look in there.

Ich Bin Kurt wrote:
Mon Jun 25, 2018 6:34 pm
Good news is I took a ~200 mile drive up and over Mt Hood yesterday and the clutch action was superb. Who knew the clutch pedal bushing needs grease?

p.s...If anyone is interested here is a pic of the VW/Audi Vent window seal(231 837 465) that Colin effortlessly installed in seconds(literally). I got this along with the door seal kit from Bus Depot.

Well, three steps forward, two back. Glad about the clutch, that counts . . .
Colin :blackeye:
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,660 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 206,845 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 116,898 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,570 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 84,465 miles

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Re: upd Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Oregon

Post by wcfvw69 » Tue Jun 26, 2018 5:01 am

Ok, I'm still not sure I understood said problemo with the distributor retarding too much? Wrong vac can or?
1970 Westfalia bus. Stock 1776 dual port type 1 engine. Restored German Solex 34-3. Restored 205Q distributor, restored to factory appearance engine.

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Re: upd Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Oregon

Post by Amskeptic » Tue Jun 26, 2018 9:20 am

wcfvw69 wrote:
Tue Jun 26, 2018 5:01 am
Ok, I'm still not sure I understood said problemo with the distributor retarding too much? Wrong vac can or?

Maybe Sean can chime in here, my 59k memory gets overwritten quickly these days.

Idle timing was 16*ATDC with retard hose on. It would snap up to around "0" with the retard hose off and successfully progress to 28*BTDC on centrifugal timing. Vacuum advance gave us around 36*BTDC

IF we decided to set the timing at idle to 7.5*, the retard would still dive down to 9-12* ATDC, but it would be too advanced at operating speed. My failed memory does not remember the number on the arm, I am only guessing 853.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,660 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 206,845 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 116,898 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,570 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 84,465 miles

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Re: upd Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Oregon

Post by SlowLane » Tue Jun 26, 2018 2:22 pm

Amskeptic wrote:
Tue Jun 26, 2018 9:20 am

Idle timing was 16*ATDC with retard hose on. It would snap up to around "0" with the retard hose off and successfully progress to 28*BTDC on centrifugal timing. Vacuum advance gave us around 36*BTDC

IF we decided to set the timing at idle to 7.5*, the retard would still dive down to 9-12* ATDC, but it would be too advanced at operating speed. My failed memory does not remember the number on the arm, I am only guessing 853.
The total range of centrrfugal advance is excessive, then. I think that can be adjusted by carefully bending the posts which limit the weight's outward excursion.
I see from the Old Volks Home ignition page that some vacuum retard cans have retard ranges in the 16-18 degree range. Is it possible that maybe one of those is fitted to the distributor?
'81 Canadian Westfalia (2.0L, manual), now Californiated

"They say a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it is not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance."
- Terry Pratchett

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Re: upd Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Oregon

Post by wcfvw69 » Tue Jun 26, 2018 6:52 pm

A Bosch 853 vacuum can specs are 11-13* retard. I bet he's got the wrong can on it.
1970 Westfalia bus. Stock 1776 dual port type 1 engine. Restored German Solex 34-3. Restored 205Q distributor, restored to factory appearance engine.

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Re: upd Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Oregon

Post by Amskeptic » Tue Jun 26, 2018 7:06 pm

wcfvw69 wrote:
Tue Jun 26, 2018 6:52 pm
A Bosch 853 vacuum can specs are 11-13* retard. I bet he's got the wrong can on it.

Why?
7.5*BTDC minus 11-13* = 3.5-5.5*ATDC. That would be perfect.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,660 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 206,845 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 116,898 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,570 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 84,465 miles

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Re: upd Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Oregon

Post by Amskeptic » Tue Jun 26, 2018 7:08 pm

SlowLane wrote:
Tue Jun 26, 2018 2:22 pm
The total range of centrrfugal advance is excessive, then. I think that can be adjusted by carefully bending the posts which limit the weight's outward excursion.
I agree. But I don't know that those posts could narrow the range as much as we need. Bill?
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,660 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 206,845 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 116,898 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,570 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 84,465 miles

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Re: upd Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Oregon

Post by 71whitewesty » Wed Jun 27, 2018 6:45 am

Hello from Yosemite. I will have a full write up about my visit once I return from our two week Bus trip. We are in Bus 2 which is running flawlessly. Almost took Bus 1 but after a 60 mile drive I decided to go back to Bus 2 for the 4 th summer in a row. More on Bus 1 later but the vacuum can is an 853. When Colin was here we put in a second distributor which also has the 853 can. So we have tried two different cans with the 853 stamping. It is a mystery to me why they don’t seem to work on this one but work great in my other two 1600’s.

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Re: upd Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Oregon

Post by 71whitewesty » Wed Jun 27, 2018 7:51 am

Ok I’m sitting in the bus at the Yosemite valley lodge while the family sleeps in. I’ll add a little on Bus 1.
I took it for a 60 mile drive and two things bothered me. One is the choke is awefully sticky and I’ll need to address that. I need t warm it up before I can really drive it. Second thing was it was giving me a slight bumping feel during my drive. Like something electrical. Pretty sure it’s not fuel related. I just experienced a similar thing on this trip and changed my points out after 30k and it fixed that issue. I might try another set in Bus 1 when I get back. I need to drive it locally some more and get the bumping feeling worked out and the choke.

On other things we did to Bus 1 like greasing and changing out rollers and guides on the slider door. It works much better now. We also fixed the horn and decided all it needed was a new horn that we took off bus 3.
More on the visit and what we did to Bus 2,3 and old yeller coming up as I have time. Internet sucks on Yosemite valley. But what a place this is. Outstanding beauty and perfect weather right now.

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Re: upd Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Oregon

Post by Amskeptic » Wed Jun 27, 2018 10:03 pm

71whitewesty wrote:
Wed Jun 27, 2018 7:51 am
Ok I’m sitting in the bus at the Yosemite valley lodge while the family sleeps in. I’ll add a little on Bus 1.
I took it for a 60 mile drive and two things bothered me. One is the choke is awefully sticky and I’ll need to address that. I need t warm it up before I can really drive it. Second thing was it was giving me a slight bumping feel during my drive. Like something electrical. Pretty sure it’s not fuel related. I just experienced a similar thing on this trip and changed my points out after 30k and it fixed that issue. I might try another set in Bus 1 when I get back. I need to drive it locally some more and get the bumping feeling worked out and the choke.

On other things we did to Bus 1 like greasing and changing out rollers and guides on the slider door. It works much better now. We also fixed the horn and decided all it needed was a new horn that we took off bus 3.
More on the visit and what we did to Bus 2,3 and old yeller coming up as I have time. Internet sucks on Yosemite valley. But what a place this is. Outstanding beauty and perfect weather right now.

You have a lucky family, you do.
Colin
(is ol yeller & co with you?)
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,660 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 206,845 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 116,898 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,570 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 84,465 miles

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Re: upd Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Oregon

Post by 71whitewesty » Fri Jun 29, 2018 11:09 am

Ol yeller was on the trip and now they are now back home. He had no problems at all which is a good thing cause he is no tools or spare tire yet. We had a great two day trip down here though.
More updates to come when I have better reception.

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Re: upd Itinerant Air-Cooled Greetings From Oregon

Post by Seventy3Bus » Sun Jul 01, 2018 4:07 pm

Colin! Sorry for the radio silence! I’ve been out on the ship for the last couple weeks.

Thanks for such a great visit. I learned a ton, we got a bunch done, and I had a good time working on the bus with you and driving around with no doors and windows! If anyone on the fence about getting on the itinerary next year, I wholeheartedly recommend it. It is well worth the money, and Colin is a great guy.

I’ve made a lot of progress since our visit. I finished putting the front doors back together (I’m pretty happy with how everything fits... not perfect but acceptable), got the bumpers on, got all of the lights in, painted most of the interior, and started re-installing doors and windows. I think I am tracking on my goal of having the bus ready for the 2018 Treffen in about three weeks time.

I’m having a hard time getting pictures to load from my phone, but will post a full update with pics when I get home later this week.

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