pay me now or pay me later...

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TrollFromDownBelow
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pay me now or pay me later...

Post by TrollFromDownBelow » Mon Jun 19, 2017 8:52 pm

.... in other words, do I stay up to tonight, or do this when I have time to do it properly....guess you folks will be stuck reading the slightly abridged, version tonight...

My goals were (I thought) fairly modest...install a windshield, and lubricate the windshield wiper transmission.... how hard can that be? right?

When Colin showed up it was a glorious Midwestern summer's day...sunny, 70's....and, a yup....as the cliche' goes, if you don't like the weather in Michigan just wait 15 minutes. "Hey Mike, those clouds look kinda dark....how much time do we have before it rains?" Me, "Umm, until you start feeling rain drops." That was about half way point of getting the windshield installed, and we decided we needed to get the bus in the garage.

Colin, "We need to push the bus in the garage." Me, we could do that, or we could just START IT and drive it in."

My suggestion is ignored, and he looks for ways for us to push the bus into the garage . Colin, "The steering wheel is locked." he finds the keys. Colin, "You really like this ignition switch buzzer." (It was buzzing ANNOYINGLY for about 5 minutes strait as we huffed and puffed to push it into the garage) Me, "Yes I do, it's survived 40 years."

Me, "OUCH!" Colin, "Is the bus okay? did we hit something?" Me, "No, we just rolled the front tire over my foot." At this point we have monsoon type of rains. Me, "Colin, can we please just drive it into the garage?" He finally gives in, and we drive it in.

Windshield install take 2 (or was it take 3?) Jeff shows up just in time and provides a much needed set of experienced hands, and oopa! it goes in!

Thanks DJ, Dan and Jeff for showing up! I always find it slightly amusing (although I understand it) that folks always thank the host for hosting a get together...but then, I think, no, I wouldn't have had the opportunity to host if no one shows up, so, therefore, the guests the most important!

Cheers,
Mike
1976 VW Bus aka tripod
FI ...not leaky, and not so noisy...and she runs awesome!
hambone wrote: There are those out there with no other aim but to bunch panties. It's like arguing with a pretzel.
::troll2::

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drober23
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Re: pay me now or pay me later...

Post by drober23 » Tue Jun 20, 2017 5:37 am

Of course guests thank the host for arranging a get-together. If you had not arranged it, I would still not have a face to put to the screen name. You know... Mike doesn't look anything like the little piggy avatar in his sig line. Nor would I have seen your nice Westy nor met your family.

That said, we had beer, brats, and lively conversation. The topics ranged from short-attention span drivers to Colin's college journey, to busses to other vehicles including but not limited to Mercedes and Lexi (the plural of Lexus?) and Don's (Hippiewannabe) propensity for wrecking vehicles which appears to run in the family. We discussed early onset adulting, goose-roundups, the fru-fru-ification of beer and the desecration of yogurt. Throughout the discussion, Colin was prepping Jeff (who has a visit tomorrow) for the types of questions and activities that will follow the next day.

Good times! I was very thankful for the opportunity to hang with you guys! I'm happy that you were still thankful we came when it was time to go.
DJ

'75 Westfalia, '79 Deluxe
(plus more busses than sense)

In a time of chimpanzees I was a monkey

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hippiewannabe
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Re: pay me now or pay me later...

Post by hippiewannabe » Tue Jun 20, 2017 1:46 pm

Thanks for hosting Mike, a very enjoyable evening. Always nice to meet car people, especially ones of the VW persuasion. Fun conversation, but very surprised it didn't veer into politics, or maybe that came later, after I left. (I get invited to two parties in a month, and they both happen on the same Monday?)

The bus looks great, congrats on the successful windshield repair. Are you going to Dream Cruise this year? Always a nice little VW show at Square Lake and Woodward.
Truth is like poetry.
And most people fucking hate poetry.

TrollFromDownBelow
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Re: pay me now or pay me later...

Post by TrollFromDownBelow » Tue Jun 20, 2017 4:28 pm

Thanks DJ for the kind words. It was nice to put a face to a name! And appreciated the gifts of steak and the beer! I am very envious of your barn and acreage situation....but I guess my 2 car garage and skinny driveway keeps me honest. It'd be fun to get together again! This time I'll bring carcass and beer, and you can show me your bus collection.

Don, always a pleasure to get together and have a few cold ones! We did eventually chat about politics, but much of the conversation was how politically apathetic people are (we were including ourselves in that group).

As for the Cruise, I do typically take a run up from about 9 mile to 16 mile (can anyone tell me why it's the Northbound side that is always jammed and not the south side?) may have to extend that up to Square Lake and check out the VW group.
1976 VW Bus aka tripod
FI ...not leaky, and not so noisy...and she runs awesome!
hambone wrote: There are those out there with no other aim but to bunch panties. It's like arguing with a pretzel.
::troll2::

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asiab3
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Re: pay me now or pay me later...

Post by asiab3 » Wed Jun 21, 2017 12:17 pm

I could not, for the life of me, figure out the northbound gridlock last year... I went from around 7 mile to somewhere in Pontiac and bitched about my clutch abuse the entire time. :)

Luckily the trip back featured a stop at Vinsetta Garage. Pizza and burgers of the highest quality, while old Weber, Holley, and Solex carbs line the walls. :drunken:

Robbie
1969 bus, "Buddy."
145k miles with me.
322k miles on Earth.

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Amskeptic
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Re: pay me now or pay me later...

Post by Amskeptic » Wed Jun 21, 2017 6:56 pm

We veered into politics, yes, hippiewannabe, at my third beer, but the current state of the Union is well past an easy tribal gathering's pep rally. It actually demands a deeper more philosophical journey to even answer how we are individually surviving and how did we get here, all of us intelligent rational informed American voters and how do we find consensus *outside of the political parties* and how do we all of us intelligent rational informed American voters actively prepare to save the Republic.

... and now, an image, courtesy our little brown cow arriving at Detroit's skyline over the railroad tracks:

Image



We have to save the Republic, from those who are so entrenched in the sickness of money-saturated quid-pro-quo Sacking Of The American Dream, that they have well and truly *given up on telling any sort of truth*.

... and now, an image, courtesy our little brown cow arriving at Detroit in the left lane at 62 mph:

Image


We have to participate even as we sit around and complain about those "we sent to Washington". I am as lazy distracted and busy as the next citizen, but it really is getting more difficult to merely watch this slow-speed trainwreck. Yeah, so we talked a bit about how to participate in the American Democracy but we also chatted up Life Plans Between Now And Death, Death Plans (party or private) and other cheerful topics of light and lively interest.

It is about concrete in Motor City, concrete:

Image


Spied a pious supplicant (supplicating the Lord is my guess) on the roof of a local church:

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The windshield was already out and the channel was painted as was the entire nose and the paint match was quite good:

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I forget what TrollFromDownBelow was doing here, but it was important. We decided to install the windshield with the same devil-may-care absence of any sort of sealant as foxmon in Scarborough Maine. Foxmon did say that his does not currently leak . . .

Image


Now TrollFromDownBelow did not look forward to the operation of installing the windshield, and TrollFromDownBelow did not acknowledge my reassurance that this particular installation went exceedingly easily on the second try, but you look at the inside corner on TrollFromDownBelow's windshield seal. That, folks, is a fully installed and seated windshield:

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TrollFromDownBelow said he did not want to do that again. But we looked at the little hairline crack at the pock on the right side windshield curve, and I suggested that next time will be even easier on account of "experience".
No, really:

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Then the visitors pored all over the Westy, droper23, TrollFromDownBelow, Hippiewannabe, WesSimpson's dad . . . and you will note the new windshield spindle seals and correctly placed wipers:

Image


Aforementioned conversation and three good beers later, I left the TrollFromDownBelow spread with his superbly innovative basement Irish Pub with those copper bar counters, and took off to recover/prepare for the next day's appointment with WesSimpson Dad.

Suffice to say, it was the first Vokswagen that kicked my ass all day and did not spare me the abject humiliation of having no friggen idea why it is so so so laggard above about 3,000 rpm, an unassuming 1980 Vanagon with breaker points and correct timing and a fully adjusted fuel mixture just could not get going above 3,000 rpm. Not only that, when I sat in the back with my finger on the wiper as WesSimpson Dad floored it up the hill, not less fuel, not more fuel, only leaving the damn thing alone gave us the best of terrible power. Now come on. Good vacuum on overrun, we drove it very briefly with no catalytic converter or muffler down his residential street at full throttle, and alas, no difference here either.

The only oddity of note was that the fuel pressure gauge went spastic during our acceleration runs, and the intake had some ugly sounding disruptions if I over-richened the mixture under load at our terrible power point, sounded like backfires in the intake plenum. Starting off and pulling at low rpm was fine! I am still mulling this one.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

ryankschulz
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Re: pay me now or pay me later...

Post by ryankschulz » Wed Jun 21, 2017 9:59 pm

Suffice to say, it was the first Vokswagen that kicked my ass all day and did not spare me the abject humiliation of having no friggen idea why it is so so so laggard above about 3,000 rpm, an unassuming 1980 Vanagon with breaker points and correct timing and a fully adjusted fuel mixture just could not get going above 3,000 rpm. Not only that, when I sat in the back with my finger on the wiper as WesSimpson Dad floored it up the hill, not less fuel, not more fuel, only leaving the damn thing alone gave us the best of terrible power. Now come on. Good vacuum on overrun, we drove it very briefly with no catalytic converter or muffler down his residential street at full throttle, and alas, no difference here either.
Ooh, sounds just like my Bus. We can mull over mine when I see you on July 3rd :cyclopsani:

TrollFromDownBelow
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Re: pay me now or pay me later...

Post by TrollFromDownBelow » Thu Jun 22, 2017 9:54 am

Amskeptic wrote:
Wed Jun 21, 2017 6:56 pm
Suffice to say, it was the first Vokswagen that kicked my ass all day and did not spare me the abject humiliation of having no friggen idea why it is so so so laggard above about 3,000 rpm, I am still mulling this one.
Colin
Jeff does not live far from me. If you desire, and he agrees, and am willing to act as a surrogate (Jeff may be very mechanically inclined... I dunno...but figure two heads better than one) if you have any brainstorms. Would you mind publishing everything you tested and tried? This issue now has me intrigued....
1976 VW Bus aka tripod
FI ...not leaky, and not so noisy...and she runs awesome!
hambone wrote: There are those out there with no other aim but to bunch panties. It's like arguing with a pretzel.
::troll2::

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mechanicjay
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Re: pay me now or pay me later...

Post by mechanicjay » Thu Jun 22, 2017 6:35 pm

TrollFromDownBelow wrote:
Thu Jun 22, 2017 9:54 am
Amskeptic wrote:
Wed Jun 21, 2017 6:56 pm
Suffice to say, it was the first Vokswagen that kicked my ass all day and did not spare me the abject humiliation of having no friggen idea why it is so so so laggard above about 3,000 rpm, I am still mulling this one.
Colin
Jeff does not live far from me. If you desire, and he agrees, and am willing to act as a surrogate (Jeff may be very mechanically inclined... I dunno...but figure two heads better than one) if you have any brainstorms. Would you mind publishing everything you tested and tried? This issue now has me intrigued....
How about rev-limiting rotor that's kicking in too early?

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Amskeptic
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Re: pay me now or pay me later...

Post by Amskeptic » Thu Jun 22, 2017 7:31 pm

mechanicjay wrote:
Thu Jun 22, 2017 6:35 pm

How about rev-limiting rotor that's kicking in too early?


Doesn't even have one.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

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Amskeptic
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Re: pay me now or pay me later...

Post by Amskeptic » Thu Jun 22, 2017 7:33 pm

TrollFromDownBelow wrote:
Thu Jun 22, 2017 9:54 am
Amskeptic wrote:
Wed Jun 21, 2017 6:56 pm
Suffice to say, it was the first Vokswagen that kicked my ass all day and did not spare me the abject humiliation of having no friggen idea why it is so so so laggard above about 3,000 rpm, I am still mulling this one.
Colin
Jeff does not live far from me. If you desire, and he agrees, and am willing to act as a surrogate (Jeff may be very mechanically inclined... I dunno...but figure two heads better than one) if you have any brainstorms. Would you mind publishing everything you tested and tried? This issue now has me intrigued....

Well, maybe we ALL could get together on Sunday afternoon.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

TrollFromDownBelow
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Re: pay me now or pay me later...

Post by TrollFromDownBelow » Fri Jun 23, 2017 5:03 am

I'm game.
1976 VW Bus aka tripod
FI ...not leaky, and not so noisy...and she runs awesome!
hambone wrote: There are those out there with no other aim but to bunch panties. It's like arguing with a pretzel.
::troll2::

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SlowLane
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Re: pay me now or pay me later...

Post by SlowLane » Sat Jun 24, 2017 10:02 am

Amskeptic wrote:
Thu Jun 22, 2017 7:31 pm
mechanicjay wrote:
Thu Jun 22, 2017 6:35 pm

How about rev-limiting rotor that's kicking in too early?
Doesn't even have one.
Colin
Here's another thing it probably doesn't have: the OXS relay. But I'm going to throw it into the ring because of two symptoms described here: the spastic fuel pressure, and the 3000 RPM threshold where the problem manifests.

The OXS relay is a feature that showed up on the CA-spec air-cooled Vanagons. Its function was to limit the amount of raw fuel dumped into the 3-way catalytic converter during full-throttle. It accomplished this by being wired in series with the WOT switch on the throttle and monitoring the engine RPM. It would only complete the WOT circuit when engine speed was over 3000 RPM, so the ECU would only get the WOT signal to go to full enrichment at engine speeds over 3000 RPM. See where the symptoms match here?

From context of the discussion (points distributor, cat easily removed with muffler), however, I don't think that this is a CA-spec engine, but after 37 years, who knows what sort of goofy hybrid setup there might be in there? Lord knows, my own setup is even goofier than that.

Have fun figuring out this puzzle, guys.
'81 Canadian Westfalia (2.0L, manual), now Californiated

"They say a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it is not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance."
- Terry Pratchett

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Amskeptic
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Re: pay me now or pay me later...

Post by Amskeptic » Sat Jun 24, 2017 6:42 pm

TrollFromDownBelow wrote:
Fri Jun 23, 2017 5:03 am
I'm game.
We're on for Sunday June 25th at noon, address has been emailed/PM'd.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

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Amskeptic
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Re: pay me now or pay me later...

Post by Amskeptic » Sat Jun 24, 2017 6:47 pm

SlowLane wrote:
Sat Jun 24, 2017 10:02 am
the OXS relay 3000 RPM threshold where the problem manifests.

Have fun figuring out this puzzle, guys.
Yes, you and I had a front row seat to the mixture shift, it was fascinating. I think it was on gauge 3MNR mid-level on the secondary pod. Or was it on the sub-mezzanine display cluster?

This is a Federal Vanagon with a full throttle switch, but these symptoms occur underneath full throttle as well as at full-throttle. Keep the ideas coming, maybe we have a CA ECU?
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

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