AAND We're Off . . .

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sgkent
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Re: AAND We're Off . . .

Post by sgkent » Thu May 18, 2017 8:27 am

70Crew wrote:
Thu May 18, 2017 7:59 am
Colin, I have 2 engine blocks sitting in my garage. The externals have been removed but they have not been split. If either of them has a good crankshaft you are welcome to it, no charge. One is a 1970 SP, the other was a 1971 DP motor. Let me know if I can do anything between now and my appointment.
that is the direction I would go. Where are these long blocks?
Thank You -

Merlin The Wrench

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Re: AAND We're Off . . .

Post by 70Crew » Thu May 18, 2017 12:13 pm

Grand Rapids, MI. Colin is scheduled here for 6/20 but I can pull a part and ship it before then if necessary.

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sgkent
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Re: AAND We're Off . . .

Post by sgkent » Thu May 18, 2017 1:16 pm

Maybe Colin can chime in. I prefer stock forged VW cranks myself for buses and bugs unless a big bore is involved. If the bore is 85.5 then the stock crank does really well.
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Merlin The Wrench

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Re: AAND We're Off . . .

Post by Bleyseng » Thu May 18, 2017 7:00 pm

Ah, but counterweighted cranks are very smooth......
Geoff
77 Sage Green Westy- CS 2.0L-160,000 miles
70 Ghia vert, black, stock 1600SP,- 139,000 miles,
76 914 2.1L-Nepal Orange- 160,000+ miles
http://bleysengaway.blogspot.com/

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Re: AAND We're Off . . .

Post by asiab3 » Thu May 18, 2017 8:42 pm

Amskeptic wrote:
Mon May 15, 2017 8:18 am
This mission may be aborted. I am giving it until Knoxville TN.

IF the exhaust valves have appreciably tightened up AGAIN for the THIRD time, Chloe goes to storage unit, and BobD goes around the country.
You can't do that, see, since you told me that BobD has one of Naranja's original warped rims…

See? You have to take Chloe. :geek:
Robbie
1969 bus, "Buddy"
"Like a good sheep dog, it is ill-suited for show competition, only becoming beautiful when it's doing its job. It is a devoted servant, delighted with its lot in life, asking only that it be treated with the respect it deserves. You can't knock that."
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Re: AAND We're Off . . .

Post by sgkent » Fri May 19, 2017 12:06 pm

Bleyseng wrote:
Thu May 18, 2017 7:00 pm
Ah, but counterweighted cranks are very smooth......
but from what I understand the quality of 10 years ago has gone downhill and even some of the best cranks have problems every so often, Besides, the more mass a crank has the greater the HP lost to speed it up and slow it down. I used to drive my 1600 DP in my 1971 bus at 6000 RPM for hours on end and the cases would last 80,000 miles between align bores. But if you are happy with a counter weighted crank then yes you should use that. The stock engine needs to go to dual carbs, a mild cam and free flowing exhaust to get any benefit anyway, and I think Chloe is running a stock induction and exhaust setup.

Supposed to be 100F plus this weekend so summer is here. What is the weather like up there? Long pleasant days and cool nights? Perfect spring weather?
Thank You -

Merlin The Wrench

Machine Work/Shop Recommendations: http://kentcomputer.com/77VW/machinework.pdf

Pointers on rebuilding an engine: http://kentcomputer.com/77VW/rebuilding_a_vw_engine.pdf

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Re: AAND We're Off . . .

Post by Schwing » Fri May 19, 2017 2:06 pm

Colin-
I just talked to my local shop thats about 15min from my place in Chester, MD and they have a few Type 4 original crankshafts.
You are due to come here on Sunday anyway for the appt. They are closed Sun but you are welcome to stay at my place and go there with me on Mon AM and root through their pile. Pretty sure they will be cheap. Just another option. Talk soon.

Jon

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Re: AAND We're Off . . .

Post by sgkent » Fri May 19, 2017 3:06 pm

Chloe is type 1 upright engine. 1600 single port I believe.
Thank You -

Merlin The Wrench

Machine Work/Shop Recommendations: http://kentcomputer.com/77VW/machinework.pdf

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Re: AAND We're Off . . .

Post by Bleyseng » Fri May 19, 2017 8:14 pm

sgkent wrote:
Fri May 19, 2017 12:06 pm
Bleyseng wrote:
Thu May 18, 2017 7:00 pm
Ah, but counterweighted cranks are very smooth......
but from what I understand the quality of 10 years ago has gone downhill and even some of the best cranks have problems every so often, Besides, the more mass a crank has the greater the HP lost to speed it up and slow it down. I used to drive my 1600 DP in my 1971 bus at 6000 RPM for hours on end and the cases would last 80,000 miles between align bores. But if you are happy with a counter weighted crank then yes you should use that. The stock engine needs to go to dual carbs, a mild cam and free flowing exhaust to get any benefit anyway, and I think Chloe is running a stock induction and exhaust setup.

Supposed to be 100F plus this weekend so summer is here. What is the weather like up there? Long pleasant days and cool nights? Perfect spring weather?
I would lighten the flywheel some to offset the weight of the counterweights. It's best for a Freeway cruiser to do not a street car.
Today was the first 70 degree day is about 3 weeks as the weather has been cold and raining, sucked....next week it will be 80 and sunny finally. Got the 914 cleaned up and ready for that!
s
Geoff
77 Sage Green Westy- CS 2.0L-160,000 miles
70 Ghia vert, black, stock 1600SP,- 139,000 miles,
76 914 2.1L-Nepal Orange- 160,000+ miles
http://bleysengaway.blogspot.com/

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Re: AAND We're Off . . .

Post by sgkent » Fri May 19, 2017 9:41 pm

enjoy the 914. :)

Bill once warned me that when lightening a flywheel properly it takes to engineering skills or trial and error to be sure the harmonic of the mass is not moved into a rod journal. The crankshaft twists back and forth about a point as the power is loaded in. As the flywheel gets lighter that point moves away from the flywheel. When the original crank and flywheel are designed, the engineers set the masses so that point is in the middle of a thick counterweight and not in a rod journal, especially near a radius.
Thank You -

Merlin The Wrench

Machine Work/Shop Recommendations: http://kentcomputer.com/77VW/machinework.pdf

Pointers on rebuilding an engine: http://kentcomputer.com/77VW/rebuilding_a_vw_engine.pdf

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Re: AAND We're Off . . .

Post by Bleyseng » Sat May 20, 2017 7:11 am

Maybe, but the 914 has one as I used to rev it to 6500+ in track and autocross racing. So the flywheel is lightened to 12lbs but the whole rotating mass was spun balanced so it could do those rpms . A bus is a different type of heavy car so I am not sure how much I would remove but the type one cranks are pretty small and the added weight wouldn't be that much noticeable in takeoff's spinning up. The smoothness would be driving down the freeway though if one is always crossing the country at 65 mph. Still it takes a good shop to spin balance the whole rotating mass including the PP and clutch disc to perfection and a straight crankshaft to start with.
Geoff
77 Sage Green Westy- CS 2.0L-160,000 miles
70 Ghia vert, black, stock 1600SP,- 139,000 miles,
76 914 2.1L-Nepal Orange- 160,000+ miles
http://bleysengaway.blogspot.com/

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Amskeptic
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Re: AAND We're Off . . .

Post by Amskeptic » Sat May 20, 2017 4:54 pm

sgkent wrote:
Wed May 17, 2017 5:12 pm
Amskeptic wrote:One bright bulb said, "yeah well how come it doesn't bend in the ENGINE, it is horizontal in the ENGINE!"
The crank in your VW engine doesn't sag because it is supported by the main journals which should be parallel if the case is straight. Stop discounting the tid-bits I share with you please. You would not be in this mess if you had taken what I told you seriously.


Steve Steve Steve, settle down. I would have been in this mess regardless of what you think you told me when you think you told me. I am in this mess in the same way you would have been in a mess if you had to take the word of a supplier/vendor/servicer. It happens. Would you have warned me that AirCooled.Net race-ready rods may not come with new nuts even though they advertised new nuts right there on the order page? No, of course not.

I'm totally with you on crank storage protocols. You did not catch that I was marveling at how someone could totally miss that a stored horizontal crank is not resting on a bunch of nice bearings like in an engine.
Colinsheesh
BobD - 1978 Bus . . . . . . . . . . .110,334 miles
Chloe - 1970 bus . . . . . . . . . . .196,812 miles
Naranja - 1977 Westfalia . . . . 72,350 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . 55,478 miles

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Re: AAND We're Off . . .

Post by Amskeptic » Sat May 20, 2017 6:38 pm

Schwing wrote:
Fri May 19, 2017 2:06 pm
Colin-
I just talked to my local shop thats about 15min from my place in Chester, MD and they have a few Type 4 original crankshafts.
You are due to come here on Sunday anyway for the appt. They are closed Sun but you are welcome to stay at my place and go there with me on Mon AM and root through their pile. Pretty sure they will be cheap. Just another option. Talk soon.

Jon



Heck, I'd be happy to pick one up 66mm and a 71mm, but this current deal is a 1600 69mm.
Colin
BobD - 1978 Bus . . . . . . . . . . .110,334 miles
Chloe - 1970 bus . . . . . . . . . . .196,812 miles
Naranja - 1977 Westfalia . . . . 72,350 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . 55,478 miles

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sgkent
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Re: AAND We're Off . . .

Post by sgkent » Wed May 24, 2017 9:00 am

I sent you a PM re two 1600 crankshafts.

As to rods - I saw so many butchered "race ready" rods when we built engines in the shop, - literally hundreds of new, and "over the counter box sets" that were junk. That is one part I prefer to have a competent race shop machinist check or do for me before using. I think Phil has a Sunnen rod hone and may still do them on special occasion if you are on terms with him.
Thank You -

Merlin The Wrench

Machine Work/Shop Recommendations: http://kentcomputer.com/77VW/machinework.pdf

Pointers on rebuilding an engine: http://kentcomputer.com/77VW/rebuilding_a_vw_engine.pdf

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