Itinerary Appointment 06/01

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wdollie6
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Itinerary Appointment 06/01

Post by wdollie6 » Fri Jun 03, 2016 8:39 am

Had a nice/interesting visit with Colin and Naranja in sunny, warm Delhi, NY. And yes lets get this out of the way I failed my post visit exam with flying colors, I think the time of evening had something to do with it, 10:15PM. I'm old, not Colin old, but old nonetheless, my brain was mush by the time the exam was administered, why this, why that, blah, blah, blah... Note that several visitors throughout the day thought that Colin's Naranja was actually my bus FatBoy, I wish!

On a more serious note was proud to be told that one of my issues was a 'first', unfortunately I think he will be posting pictures of the issue at some point (his term for the damaged part was "slightly compromised". The day before his arrival I was adjusting the valves and changing the oil on my Super Beetle only to find a crankcase full of a wonderful gas/oil mix. Knowing that my carb had been rebuilt and only had a few miles on it I immediately suspected the original fuel pump (had the built-in filter, already miss it...), after fighting the rear bolt to remove found that everything below was drenched in fuel, diagnostic correct (my last correct one for a few days).

Called multiple local parts places (20+ miles is close right?) and actually found a cheapo replacement. Installed it, tightened the bolts down and was off to the front to install a fuel filter under the tank, once installed, turned it over all was good... but no start. Turns out when installing I found out that my fuel pump rod was defective :drunken: , oh and a little long for the new pump, and actually bent it severely while tightening. Colin determined this once we took the pump back off. Neither of us are sure of how this could have happened but Colin ventured to guess that it might have to do with lack of feeling in my fingers, i.e. not knowing my own strength. Apparently should have felt the resistance as I was tightening it down, easy for him to say.

While a bent rod is not the end of the world try getting it out of the hole, clearly our first battle of the day, which we eventually won but not without a few choice words and using a multitude of tools to finally remove the phenolic block (the upper part at least) and then were able to remove the rod by taking some of the bend away. Unfortunately the lower portion of the phenolic remained, Colin came up with the idea of using a properly sized lag screw to tap into the remnants then pull out, it actually worked!!! We are both hopeful that nothing else is damaged and the remaining small pieces of phenolic won't cause any issues, my comment "Colin don't worry that crap will just get chewed up when I start it...", we shall see. When the comment "split the case" came out I suggested we move on to the real task the Type 4 engine that is waiting to go back in my bus. Yesterday ordered a new, I say phenolic you say plastic, block and both length pushrods as I am still somewhat confused as to the proper height, 108mm or 100 mm for the replacement pump. I'll know soon enough.

We were both optimistic that the engine would be quite straight forward as compared to the fuel pump issue but not to be. First a few minor adjustments :scratch: had to be made; re-indexing of the distributor gear (I was only 12-15 degrees out), adjustment to the throttle stops, chokes and fast idle links and then finally set static timing. Once we fired it up demonstrated same characteristics of lousy idle which Colin was able to overcome to some degree, actually ran continuously by itself for several minutes, impressive. We also determined that I was missing the pressed in angled vents that go to the float bowl, my two other carbs also did not have these parts, huh? Do these routinely fall out of carbs as I am 0 for 4 ? Anyone have one or two floating around? By the way we can attest that these are difficult to remove and replace, enough said...

At the end of the day and multiple diagnostics later the engine was running but timing was wandering, too say the least. The final diagnostic was that we would need to rebuild or replace the distributor as most everything else seemed to be in reasonable shape, especially after Colin had completed his adjustments and evaluation. He was especially impressed that I had broken in the engine without a method of checking oil pressure... NOT! My bad, for some reason never even crossed my mind :pale: . The good news is that everything appears to be fine in other words I was very, very lucky. I also apparently have to go back a few steps, remove the muffler and heat exchangers and actually replace the copper gaskets on the exhausts. I fought the good fight with these and lost so went forward with the build, the only positive is that we actually used the exhaust leak in number one for diagnostic purposes.

I have actually found an NOS distributor that was recently posted to the classified in the other site which based on a conversation, pictures, and VW/Bosch part numbers appears to be the exact part I need. While a little pricey I WANT MY ENGINE TO RUN AS INTENDED, a small investment to make to finish the job.

Colin thank you for joining us in wonderful upstate NY and look forward to your next visit either in FL or NY...

Also, by the way I am serious about the need for the angled vents if anyone has any they would like to share let me know.

Finally a picture of Colin, apparently my stand was a little tall... funny it was fine for me :salute:
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20160601_144246 Colin Visit.gif
1972 Superbeetle Convertible
1972 Westy Bus
1972 Beetle
1970 Fastback
1966 6V Beetle with Sunroof

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asiab3
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Re: Itinerary Appointment 06/01

Post by asiab3 » Fri Jun 03, 2016 10:57 am

wdollie6, thanks for the write-up! I felt like I was there for some of it. =D>

And I don't think your stand was too tall, I think Colin's spine is just bent that way from living with those dual carbs for over two decades… :pirate:

Robbie
1969 bus, "Buddy."
145k miles with me.
322k miles on Earth.

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wdollie6
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Re: Itinerary Appointment 06/01

Post by wdollie6 » Fri Jun 03, 2016 11:50 am

Thanks Robbie wasn't sure where to put it... A great visit and educational to say the least.

Wayne
1972 Superbeetle Convertible
1972 Westy Bus
1972 Beetle
1970 Fastback
1966 6V Beetle with Sunroof

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Re: Itinerary Appointment 06/01

Post by Jivermo » Fri Jun 03, 2016 1:39 pm

Great post...you had me laughing out loud, especially the engine oil pressure bit. I can just picture the head going into the Colin tilt, the left side lip begin to curl, as he begins to seriously regard you, and say not a thing at all for some moments. I have been in that spot, and it feels like you are once again in the principal's office in third grade, and your world has turned to shit. Hahahaha!

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Re: Itinerary Appointment 06/01

Post by Amskeptic » Fri Jun 03, 2016 8:23 pm

Well wdollie6 . . .

You have shown great restraint and classy kindness in not bringing up my own . . . exceptionally retarded timing ( I arrived at 10:45 because Map Quest and I had a profound disagreement and my brain just would not absorb what wdollie6's spouse patiently tried to tell me over the phone). But it was such a beautiful day:

Image


The aimless wandering about the heart of the what, Leatherstocking? Catskills? Finger Lakes? region of New York as I watched the clock on the dash just spin around, it was just too pretty to get too cross:

Image


I was on County Road 14, the directions seemed easy enough, Naranja was feeling smooth and quiet and the fuel pump was only whining "wretchedly" as opposed to let's say, "alarmingly". Look at this thing of beauty, such frailty, such brave brinksmanship :

Image


Eventually I fell into town on a downhill:

Image


MapQuest said I had arrived at the correct address at some almost shanty-looking rundown houses perched on the hillside. Beat dead pick-ups littered the lot across from the house. "Ahh, rural New York," I thought, "he loves Volkswagens somewhere around here." But I called anyway. That is when I was informed that I was still 6 miles out. Finally got to the real house with a full-on hate at MapQuest going on. Saw TWO VWs, a sunroof '66 and the won't start '72 Super Beetle. Was welcomed with,
"I hope you work on VWs better than you take directions."
I replied with something like,
"I used to be so smart . . . what happened?"

We got to diagnosing the no-start and quickly arrived at the fuel pump. After a brutal-but-gentle distributor pull, we arrived at a stuck fuel pump push rod, and it required a brutal-but-gentle extraction.

Image


The later "alternator-style" fuel pumps are are canted over and "squished down" to avoid the alternator on 1974 and newer 1600 engines. Their actuators are attendantly lower in the fuel pump flange. If you use the earlier 8mm longer push rod on one of these pumps, it will sort of pretzel itself shorter. Here is the moment of dawning realization that the alternator-style fuel pumps require a shorter push rod. :

Image



Thus, we began a challenging day of addressing distributor driveshaft slot orientations in both the Beetle and the bus engines, and we performed static timing procedures and we performed stroboscopic timing on the bus engine which just sat there on the bench while we tried to get it sorted out:

Image


I must say, never has adjusting a 1972 dual carburetor bus engine been any easier, even whilst ricketily precariously rocketing back and forth on an upside down bucket on tip-toe. We had to dive into the left carburetor due to a mild flood of gasoline down the throat. I determined that the lack of a float bowl vent was causing too much flow due to the pressure differential between the bowl and the venturi. That's my story and I am sticking to it. As a matter of fact, fact, I tell ya, that vent is exactly the equivalent of the fuel pressure regulator in the FI systems. Well, it is. We did a bunch of carburetor adjustments and I did a piss-poor job of explaining what I was doing because the engine was "sliding around under us", a phrase that describes the consequences of a distributor that veered from 16* ATDC (nach) to off the scale 40*+ BTDC on the advance side (vor). There was no way to dial it in. There shall be more to come when we have a tightly controlled distributor advance.

These folks were beyond welcoming and solicitous, they plied me with coffee, lunch, dinner, maple sap, rhubarb cobbler, and we even chatted up some politics and business in between my occasional bouts of almost catatonic incredulity that ANYONE would break in an engine without any sort of oil pressure monitoring whatsoever . . .

So, after my morning's display of simple-mindedness, me and MapQuest, I was given very careful, very concise directions back to the interstate. Never did find it. Wafted my way to Walton instead, on Route 10 south then caught 17/ "future" I-86 at Deposit. See, that is what I actually wanted . . .
Colin :blackeye:
(it was most excellent meeting you and the family, wdollie6)
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

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wdollie6
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Re: Itinerary Appointment 06/01

Post by wdollie6 » Sat Jun 04, 2016 3:53 am

Colin, so instead of left, straight, left, left, straight, you decided to go left, left, right and right then straight which is no problem as all roads eventually end up where you want to be... Safe travels see you in the fall somewhere.
1972 Superbeetle Convertible
1972 Westy Bus
1972 Beetle
1970 Fastback
1966 6V Beetle with Sunroof

EskimoTom
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Re: Itinerary Appointment 06/01

Post by EskimoTom » Sat Jun 04, 2016 5:14 am

Great write ups, thank you both. My very first Colin visit comes up on the 26th, looking forward to it. Colin, you keep mentioning MapQuest. Unless you hate Google, Google Maps has always been more accurate than MapQuest. Eskimo Tom
1971 Camper. Sportmobile. "Rusty"

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Re: Itinerary Appointment 06/01

Post by Jivermo » Sat Jun 04, 2016 10:26 am

Man, Colin, you're right on the money about that "Future I-86" on Route 17. I think that sign has been up for decades now. I had dinner in Deposit about 2 weeks ago...those little Delaware River towns intrigue me. I regret that my timing at the lake was not in sync with your visit to Delhi; it's always a delight to muck about in canoes and kayaks with you, and we don't need to have carb cleaner on hand!

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Re: Itinerary Appointment 06/01

Post by VWGirl » Mon Jun 06, 2016 4:31 am

Interesting that I got a notification on this post that a new reply had been made since I last checked.... I haven't even been on this page since this original post was made! Only by about a month... how odd...

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Re: Itinerary Appointment 06/01

Post by jackstar » Mon Jun 06, 2016 4:39 am

Has anyone notice Tropical Storm COLIN closing in on Florida.? I knew he was tyrannical but stormy? Hmmm who 'd a thunk it.

Jack

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Happyfolk
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Re: Itinerary Appointment 06/01

Post by Happyfolk » Mon Jun 06, 2016 10:06 am

Tropical Storm Colin Is Approaching Florida, Tropical Storm Warnings Issued

https://weather.com/storms/hurricane/ne ... -june-2016

Colin, did you take a detour???
79 CA FI Westy
Mexico Beige
"Sandy"

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wdollie6
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Re: Itinerary Appointment 06/01

Post by wdollie6 » Mon Jul 18, 2016 9:28 am

Good news, FATBOY is up and running on the road (illegally of course) for the first time since 1974 at least based on what the owner told me (in reality she was the owner by default at least according to NY law). More importantly this was my first self powered drive since I purchased the bus for $0.00 in the fall of 2013. I proudly sat on the seat stand peering over the windshield for the maiden journey with the Colin tuned, dual-carb engine purring behind me, forgot what it felt like to drive a boat... or rather a bus. Definitely not a Super Beetle.

Unfortunately my excitement to drive the bus outweighed more practical considerations like remembering to adjust the pushrod in the new brake vacuum canister, or for that matter the clamp at the pipe to vacuum hose connector in the front. Oh yeah also didn't tighten the clamp at the fuel tank completely, thankfully found that issue quickly. The only glaring concern was the fact that my oil fill pipe had a crack in it, found only when traversing the ups and downs of the northern Catskills (for some reason when I painted it didn't find it). Cleaned the pipe and applied some JB Weld, will check tonight to see if the issue is addressed.

So with roof on can now begin the next chapter, finishing out the interior and oh yeah screwing down the pop up canvas, not looking forward to that. 265 lbs. climbing up to fasten in a zillion screws smaller than a brad...
Fat Boy on the Road 3.jpg
1972 Superbeetle Convertible
1972 Westy Bus
1972 Beetle
1970 Fastback
1966 6V Beetle with Sunroof

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wdollie6
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Re: Itinerary Appointment 06/01

Post by wdollie6 » Mon Jul 18, 2016 9:28 am

Fat Boy On the Road.jpg
1972 Superbeetle Convertible
1972 Westy Bus
1972 Beetle
1970 Fastback
1966 6V Beetle with Sunroof

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Re: Itinerary Appointment 06/01

Post by 71whitewesty » Mon Jul 18, 2016 10:17 pm

Wow, that bus is looking great! Screwing that canvas down isn't too bad. You can even spread it out over a couple of beers. Maybe save the last two corners until the next morning. :blackeye:

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Amskeptic
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Re: Itinerary Appointment 06/01

Post by Amskeptic » Tue Jul 19, 2016 10:06 am

wdollie6 wrote:Good news, FATBOY is up and running on the road (illegally of course) for the first time since 1974

So with roof on can now begin the next chapter, finishing out the interior
Excellent! Looking good. New York seems so long ago . . . :
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

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