'82 Vanagon. How Do You Count The Pins On the ECU?

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dweomer21
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'82 Vanagon. How Do You Count The Pins On the ECU?

Post by dweomer21 » Thu Jan 22, 2009 12:37 am

Criminy! I've spent the last hour trying to figure out where, (for example) pin 25 is on the ecu harness, but no where can I find any reference for how to count them. Google searches, manuals, nothing. I see a reference to where pin 1 is in the Bentley manual, but that helps me in no way whatsoever if I want to figure out where pin 25 is. Do you count like on an IC? (Up one side, then straight over to the other side and back -- kind of like a circle). Or, does one count the pins up the one side, then up the other side, starting from the same end both times? Or do you count them some other way?

I realize that once you know this kind of thing, you don't need a reference to it, but am I the only one who gets frustrated every time something like this is omitted from the manuals, when it seems like such an obvious and easy thing to put in them? (Or is it actually in the manual, and I'm too dense to spot it?)
*grumble*
*sigh*
Third time this week I've been cut short on my troubleshooting because of typos or omissions in Bentley and in Muir's manual.
Bad week I guess.

O.k., rant is over :)
Thanks for any help!
--scott

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vwlover77
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Post by vwlover77 » Thu Jan 22, 2009 5:30 am

Going from memory here, I believe the pins numbers are in the IC / circle scheme you mentioned. Start at 1, count to the end of the connector, move to the other side, and work your way back.

I could never find a reference to this either. I think what finally clued me in was that my ECU does not have pins at every location. I compared the ECU with the wiring diagram. When there was no pin where apparently there should have been, I knew I was counting pins from the wrong end.

Or, you can trace a few of the connections with your ohmmeter to verify - if the harness is good!
Don

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78 Westy
71 Super Beetle Convertible Autostick

"When we let our compassion go, we let go of whatever claim we have to the divine." - Bruce Springsteen

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Amskeptic
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Post by Amskeptic » Thu Jan 22, 2009 9:21 am

The ECU connector has two rows of contacts. The *longer* row is the one with #1 as your reference. #1 is at the bottom of the row where the connector latches, that would make it lower right in a VW bus. #18 is upper right where the hook is. Then you go back down to the lower *left* to start #19 and count your way back up to #35 at the top.
Colin
(by the way, if you peel back the boot at the ECU, all the wires have numbers. #1 for example, goes to the coil (-).
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

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dingo
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Post by dingo » Thu Jan 22, 2009 8:01 pm

Where does 25 go? My ECU pin chart shows no #25 at all.
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';78 Tranzporter 2L

" Fill what's empty, empty what's full, and scratch where it itches."

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Amskeptic
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Post by Amskeptic » Thu Jan 22, 2009 9:11 pm

dingo wrote:Where does 25 go? My ECU pin chart shows no #25 at all.
#25 is not used.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

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KYLE
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Post by KYLE » Sat Jan 24, 2009 11:35 am

I hate to dispute you, but your description isn't quite right. Pin #1 is on the long row, but it is nearest to where the wires exit. Pin #18 is at the end of that row furthest from the wires. Pin #19 is in the short row nearest the wires and pin #35 is on the other end. I was trying to post some pics, but it just ain't working for me. The numbers are visible if you remove the cover from the connector.

From what I have seen the common pins used for 76-83 are: 1,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,13,14,15,16,17,20,27,32,33,34

This doesn't include the CAL emissioned systems, which I don't know off the top of my head.

The Full Throttle Switch is 3,18 but is usually only seen on Vanagons.

I have noticed a few odd balls that included 12, but it has been debated what that was for and I have never seen any documentation to serve as the final work in my mind.


Since I can't get the picture to work, here is a link to a connector pinout the I drew up.


http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3487/322 ... c49a_o.jpg

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Amskeptic
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Post by Amskeptic » Sat Jan 24, 2009 12:42 pm

KYLE wrote:I hate to dispute you, but your description isn't quite right. Pin #1 is on the long row, but it is nearest to where the wires exit.
You are correct. I have had to delete my old L-Jet pdf which was so wrong. Damn them.
Thanks. #12 40 and 41 go to a Porsche 914 L Jet altitude compensator.
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

dweomer21
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Post by dweomer21 » Sat Jan 24, 2009 1:16 pm

I didn't know that the pins were labeled under the boot. Once I took the plastic connector cover off, my problems with the numbering were solved :)
Strangely, (or not), I am missing the following pins in my ECU connector:
2, 3, 11, 12, 18, 19, 21 - 26, 28-31, & 35.
I expected some of these to be gone, but some of them are included in the ohmmeter troubleshooting routine in Bentley.... so I'm not sure what's going on there.

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Amskeptic
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Post by Amskeptic » Sat Jan 24, 2009 1:40 pm

dweomer21 wrote:I didn't know that the pins were labeled under the boot. Once I took the plastic connector cover off, my problems with the numbering were solved :)
Strangely, (or not), I am missing the following pins in my ECU connector:
2, 3, 11, 12, 18, 19, 21 - 26, 28-31, & 35.
I expected some of these to be gone, but some of them are included in the ohmmeter troubleshooting routine in Bentley.... so I'm not sure what's going on there.
What is your make and model? Check your specific wiring diagram.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

dweomer21
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Post by dweomer21 » Sat Jan 24, 2009 3:35 pm

I have an '82 Vanagon camper. M/T, and Federal emissions.
The "wrench in the works" is that the previous owner swapped in a GE series engine, which as best as I can determine, is from a '79 bus. This is mostly annoying because this engine isn't covered in my $90 Bentley manual (grrrrr). I'm assuming that the ECU harness is the same as was originally in the camper, but there's an outside chance that he may have swapped in the ECU/harness/etc from the 79 bus in order to get the thing working with the slightly mismatched engine. (At least, that's my theory).

Maybe I'm over thinking his engine swap, but this scenario makes troubleshooting a bit more frustrating than usual :pale:

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vwlover77
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Post by vwlover77 » Sat Jan 24, 2009 3:49 pm

Mechanically, the GE Series engine should be nearly identical to the Vanagon engine except for the ancillaries like the exhaust, oil fill tube, etc.

I'm guessing that by '82, the Vanagon FI system had an oxygen sensor. Does yours have one? Can you pull the ECU and check its part number? That may help unravel the mystery.

What kind of problems are you experiencing?
Don

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78 Westy
71 Super Beetle Convertible Autostick

"When we let our compassion go, we let go of whatever claim we have to the divine." - Bruce Springsteen

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Post by dweomer21 » Sat Jan 24, 2009 8:11 pm

Yeah, the former owner rigged up a custom oil fill tube, since the vanagon engine compartment doesn't open in the same way as the buses.... it works fine, but the dipstick, on the other hand, is in a really awkward place, and I'm not sure how to modify it to make it better.
But I digress.
I'm sure this is a pretty basic question, but where would I find the oxygen sensor? Actually, I can look it up in the manual... I'll check it out tomorrow, and while I'm at it, I'll pull the ECU for the part number. I'll post the results tomorrow.
Thanks again guys (and/or gals)!
--scott

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KYLE
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Post by KYLE » Sat Jan 24, 2009 8:19 pm

Actually, it was only the CAL Vanagons and 79 CAL bus that had an oxygen sensor prior to the change to Digi-Jet midyear 83. The easiest way to identify if you have a CAL is that there is no FI resistor bank on the firewall, only the double relay. Bentley made it a bit confusing by only having schematics for the CAL in the Vanagon Manual, but I assure you that most are 49 state and basically the same electrically as 76-79 harnesses except for the full throttle switch leads.

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Post by dweomer21 » Wed Jan 28, 2009 8:33 pm

Sorry for the delay in posting the results. Been a crazy week :)
So, my ECU has these two numbers on it:
0 399 060 21B
280 000 178

Also, to my chagrin, I discovered that I actually have an '81 vanagon, not an '82. The engine is still the GE series, which is a... '79 bus?

--scott

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Amskeptic
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Post by Amskeptic » Thu Jan 29, 2009 6:14 pm

dweomer21 wrote:Sorry for the delay in posting the results. Been a crazy week :)
So, my ECU has these two numbers on it:
0 399 060 21B
280 000 178

Also, to my chagrin, I discovered that I actually have an '81 vanagon, not an '82. The engine is still the GE series, which is a... '79 bus?

--scott
That is a 1979 manual transmission Federal baywindow bus ECU.
You should know that the swap-ability between these parts is usually pretty good. Sounds like you are mostly matched up. Ox sensor is screwed into the crossover pipe elbow as it enters the cat (or not) and has a green wire that plugs into a disconnect near the coil-ish area on the left.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

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