'73 Bus - Shifting Issues

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hambone
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'73 Bus - Shifting Issues

Post by hambone » Tue Aug 21, 2012 2:31 pm

This old gal doesn't want to shift consistently. It goes from impossible to find any gear to shifting a bit vague but OK, and then it crunches gears upon the next shift. It does not appear to be related to any specific gear.

The shift coupler looks OK, a bit of looseness but looks tight otherwise. Not sure if that could effect things.

Could this have something to do with the front shift rod bushings? If it was a shifter adjustment then I think it would be consistently bad, not on and off.
Or, is this poor transaxle dying? Nose cone issues?
Thank you!
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hambone
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Re: '73 Bus - Shifting Issues

Post by hambone » Thu Aug 23, 2012 2:55 pm

Hi, allow me to BUMP because I don't know where to go with this issue. Sloppy sloppy shifting, sometimes able to find the "H" pattern, sometimes not.
I am thinking the coupler, but obviously not sure.
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tristessa
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Re: '73 Bus - Shifting Issues

Post by tristessa » Thu Aug 23, 2012 9:31 pm

How's the front bushing? How sloppy is the coupler?

I've got new of both if you need 'em...
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hambone
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Re: '73 Bus - Shifting Issues

Post by hambone » Fri Aug 24, 2012 12:47 pm

Ya know, I just need to spend some time and take everything apart. It's hard to troubleshoot an issue I've not yet had experience with, without looking at the parts and digging the system.
Thanks Hal.
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http://pdxvolksfolks.blogspot.com
it balances on your head just like a mattress balances on a bottle of wine
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tristessa
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Re: '73 Bus - Shifting Issues

Post by tristessa » Sat Aug 25, 2012 9:25 am

If'n you want the parts come by this evening and pick 'em up. Fancypants Shepski is swinging by for some welding on his exhaust (patch job until he gets new parts) around 5:30-6:00...
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Amskeptic
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Re: '73 Bus - Shifting Issues

Post by Amskeptic » Sun Aug 26, 2012 6:27 am

hambone wrote:Ya know, I just need to spend some time and take everything apart. It's hard to troubleshoot an issue I've not yet had experience with, without looking at the parts and digging the system.
Thanks Hal.
If every gear is difficult and you have grinding, start with checking for full disengagement of the clutch.
The '73 bus can find its gears with a very sloppy shifter because it does not have the hated later spring-loaded shifter stealing all the slop in one direction only.

Adjust the stop plate sloppily: put in 2nd gear, loosen the stop plate, move the reverse lock-out plate against the shoulder of the shifter, then wiggle shifter until you see the lock-out plate skip sideways by a millimeter, tighten and check.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

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hambone
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Re: '73 Bus - Shifting Issues

Post by hambone » Fri Sep 07, 2012 1:46 pm

I have been screwing with this thing for 2 hours.
This is consistent:
3 of the gears are found easily. 1st gear, however, is just to the right of where it should be. If you clunk the shifter all the way to the left (neutral), it won't go into first. If you step it to the right slightly, it will find first. Adjustments keep this weird relationship consistent.
I crawled under and checked the coupling, no play when I wiggle it. It moves the shift rod along with it.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated!
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hambone
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Re: '73 Bus - Shifting Issues

Post by hambone » Thu Sep 13, 2012 1:51 pm

I replaced the coupler, quite a bit different. Better, but still not quite right.
There is a lot of play where the shift rod goes thru the frame member up front, just behind the bellows (and into a metal tube). Would that contribute to shifting issues?

If so, it looks like the shift rod must come out to access the old bushing. PITA.

Also, why do replacement bushings have little round tabs inside? Wouldn't that interfere with the shift rod?
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Amskeptic
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Re: '73 Bus - Shifting Issues

Post by Amskeptic » Sun Sep 16, 2012 5:40 pm

hambone wrote: There is a lot of play where the shift rod goes thru the frame member up front,
Perfectly normal.

If 1st is not going in along the left side of the stop plate gate, just move the forward end of the stop plate towards the right side of the car, almost as if you were doing the 2nd gear/reverse cut-out adjustment. It really is that simple. The stop plate has gobs of rotate-able slop that you use to your requirements.

Hambone, these Type 4 buses hang the engine and transaxle on compliant rubber mounts. Shifting changed forever after. The earlier buses let you shift quickly and precisely, the later buses do not. The Vanagons had to change the whole system to this huge clunky notchy shifter to allow even more compliance of the driveline.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles

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hambone
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Re: '73 Bus - Shifting Issues

Post by hambone » Sun Sep 16, 2012 8:59 pm

Thank you Colin I will give it another shot. Also appreciate your input on shifter slop.

Are the shift rod bushings actually attached to the shift rod itself? It seems like they slide back and forth instead of remaining stationary like the Beetle. Is this correct? Bentley is very unclear about this, besides the exploded diagram.
The rear shift rod is actually pretty long - and the transmission must come out to replace those bushings.
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satchmo
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Re: '73 Bus - Shifting Issues

Post by satchmo » Sun Sep 16, 2012 9:51 pm

hambone wrote:Thank you Colin I will give it another shot. Also appreciate your input on shifter slop.

Are the shift rod bushings actually attached to the shift rod itself? It seems like they slide back and forth instead of remaining stationary like the Beetle. Is this correct? Bentley is very unclear about this, besides the exploded diagram.
The rear shift rod is actually pretty long - and the transmission must come out to replace those bushings.
Yes, the bushings are attached to the shift rod inside that long tube that goes from front to back. Here is a picture of the original and a poorly made replacement bushing:

Image

Guess which one is which?

Tim
By three methods we may learn wisdom:
First, by reflection, which is noblest;
second, by immitation, which is easiest;
and third, by experience, which is bitterest. -Confucius

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hambone
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Re: '73 Bus - Shifting Issues

Post by hambone » Tue Sep 18, 2012 1:20 pm

That did it!!!! The shifting is perfect now. I was going the opposite direction before when adjusting the stop plate.
I don't even want to know why moving the plate to the right fixed it. It seems like it would make things worse. But the adjustment seems to be more about alignment with the transmission/shift rod than the shifter itself.
This site is the bees-knees on my ongoing apprenticeship. Ida' be screwed otherwise! thank you thank you
http://greencascadia.blogspot.com
http://pdxvolksfolks.blogspot.com
it balances on your head just like a mattress balances on a bottle of wine
your brand new leopard skin pillbox hat

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