Cool Hand Sluggo! Great story and write up!Sluggo wrote:Everything about me is "Too Cool"!hambone wrote:Who knows, maybe it was "too cool" before.
Oil in the #4 combustion chamber!
- Sylvester
- Bad Old Puddy Tat.
- Location: Sylvester, Georgia
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Re: Oil in the #4 combustion chamber!
Up, up the long, delirious, burning blue, I’ve topped the wind-swept heights with easy grace. Where never lark, or even eagle flew. And, while with silent, lifting mind I've trod, The high untrespassed sanctity of space, Put out my hand, and touched the face of God.
- Amskeptic
- IAC "Help Desk"
- Status: Offline
Re: Oil in the #4 combustion chamber!
That is a dangerous sign of why you had a problem. Remember my "Anomalies are the more likely culprit, a short hot day freeway run with a horrible fuel mixture", You betcha. What fuel system do you have on this engine? Factory FI?Sluggo wrote:
According to the VDO It's getting up to 490* on a steep incline. Average highway temps are about 375*.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles
- hambone
- Post-Industrial Non-Secular Mennonite
- Location: Portland, Ore.
- Status: Offline
Re: Oil in the #4 combustion chamber!
So, you can have a cool engine but hot heads? I thought the engine was like 1 big heat sink, hot is hot allover. It would seem that an overheating engine would be pretty obvious: smells, lack of power, etc. But then again I've never deviated from stock besides an 009.
http://greencascadia.blogspot.com
http://pdxvolksfolks.blogspot.com
it balances on your head just like a mattress balances on a bottle of wine
your brand new leopard skin pillbox hat
http://pdxvolksfolks.blogspot.com
it balances on your head just like a mattress balances on a bottle of wine
your brand new leopard skin pillbox hat
- Sluggo
- Wishin' I was Fishin'
- Location: Portland, Or.
- Contact:
- Status: Offline
Re: Oil in the #4 combustion chamber!
Dual Weber 36 IDFs with a hex bar. Opened up the mixture a little today and it seems to be better.Amskeptic wrote:That is a dangerous sign of why you had a problem. Remember my "Anomalies are the more likely culprit, a short hot day freeway run with a horrible fuel mixture", You betcha. What fuel system do you have on this engine? Factory FI?Sluggo wrote:
According to the VDO It's getting up to 490* on a steep incline. Average highway temps are about 375*.
Colin
1977 Bus with Sunroof - "Lucky '77"
2000cc Type IV w/Dual Weber 36s,
Aircooled.net SVDA w/Compufire,
Redline Weber Fuel Pump,
Holley Regulator,
Half Ass Brush & Roller Rustoleum Paint Job,
Incomplete Custom Interior,
Dual Batteries,
Crunched Slider Door.
------------------------------------------------------
- chitwnvw
- Resident Troublemaker
- Location: Chicago.
- Status: Offline
Re: Oil in the #4 combustion chamber!
490? Yikes, I almost soiled myself when I saw 450! Luckily this engine broke in and this last road trip to Des Moines saw no hotter than 417 on some pretty steep and extended inclines.
- Amskeptic
- IAC "Help Desk"
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Re: Oil in the #4 combustion chamber!
Remember that only the main jets are responsible for the mixture out on the road. If you are running hot under load at speed, you need to up the main jets. Are these the carbs from your old bus? Geeze, I don't even know what you are running. Was the old bus already at 2 liters?Sluggo wrote:Dual Weber 36 IDFs with a hex bar. Opened up the mixture a little today and it seems to be better.Amskeptic wrote:That is a dangerous sign of why you had a problem. Remember my "Anomalies are the more likely culprit, a short hot day freeway run with a horrible fuel mixture", You betcha. What fuel system do you have on this engine? Factory FI?Sluggo wrote:
According to the VDO It's getting up to 490* on a steep incline. Average highway temps are about 375*.
Colin
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles
- Sluggo
- Wishin' I was Fishin'
- Location: Portland, Or.
- Contact:
- Status: Offline
Re: Oil in the #4 combustion chamber!
I'll check the mains. I have a whole set of jets. I think I have 130's in there. I can bump em up to 135. I changed em right before I moved to Oregon.Amskeptic wrote:Remember that only the main jets are responsible for the mixture out on the road. If you are running hot under load at speed, you need to up the main jets. Are these the carbs from your old bus? Geeze, I don't even know what you are running. Was the old bus already at 2 liters?
Colin
These are the carbs from my old Bus and the engine has been 2 liters since I rebuilt it in 2005.
1977 Bus with Sunroof - "Lucky '77"
2000cc Type IV w/Dual Weber 36s,
Aircooled.net SVDA w/Compufire,
Redline Weber Fuel Pump,
Holley Regulator,
Half Ass Brush & Roller Rustoleum Paint Job,
Incomplete Custom Interior,
Dual Batteries,
Crunched Slider Door.
------------------------------------------------------
-
- IAC Addict!
- Status: Offline
Re: Oil in the #4 combustion chamber!
If I understand my observational experience right, it's more of a balancing act.hambone wrote:So, you can have a cool engine but hot heads? I thought the engine was like 1 big heat sink, hot is hot allover. It would seem that an overheating engine would be pretty obvious: smells, lack of power, etc. But then again I've never deviated from stock besides an 009.
Since the oil is cooling the engine, there is a correspondent rise in oil temp when the head temps go down. For example; if you're sitting at a light, the engine isn't working much ~ head temps down. The oil is absorbing the heat coming off the engine, but isn't being cooled much ~ oil temps up.
Working properly, my AC vanagon would balance out around Colin's sweet spot of 220F oil temp and 350-400 head temp (depending on the rise/fall of the road and other factors). I knocked it out of whack though, two years ago. Drove to Vegas during the daytime in August. Going up the last large incline at 35 mph saw the following temps:
Oil 270
Head 430
That oil was really working hard... Made it to Vegas and back though.
Best,
L
- Amskeptic
- IAC "Help Desk"
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Re: Oil in the #4 combustion chamber!
Depends.Lanval wrote:If I understand my observational experience right, it's more of a balancing act.hambone wrote:So, you can have a cool engine but hot heads? I thought the engine was like 1 big heat sink, hot is hot allover. It would seem that an overheating engine would be pretty obvious: smells, lack of power, etc. But then again I've never deviated from stock besides an 009.
Since the oil is cooling the engine, there is a correspondent rise in oil temp when the head temps go down. For example; if you're sitting at a light, the engine isn't working much ~ head temps down. The oil is absorbing the heat coming off the engine, but isn't being cooled much ~ oil temps up.
The oil will absorb head heat in the rocker area under load and bring it to the sump. The pistons will absorb bucketloads of heat at the same time and heat up the oil splashing on their undersides. The heads will heat up the quickest on this uphill. Downhill, the heads will cool soonest, but *they are still hotter than everything else* and the heat graph is still going up in the heavy metal like connecting rods and crankshaft. As long as the engine is moving, the crankcase fins help the oil arrive at "homeostasis". When you pull into the gas pumps and shut off the engine, the exhaust and heads cool down quickly 800s on down at the exhaust valves, head material will be in the 400s and falling but that heat is still hotter than the case and the oil and they will *rise* in temperature as you sit at the pumps.
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles
- Sluggo
- Wishin' I was Fishin'
- Location: Portland, Or.
- Contact:
- Status: Offline
Re: Oil in the #4 combustion chamber!
Went on a three hour each way camping trip this weekend. Lot's of hills. Ran like a champ the entire time. Still not even one drop of oil under the engine. The highest temp I saw was 455. Usually ran between 410 & 440 up hills. 375 to 410 on flat land. About 325 at idle.
Checked my mains and they are 135 which is pretty big. I have a thought though. About 10 months ago I changed out the needles to 50's from 75's. Could this have caused the float bowls to be almost drained at full throttle and cause a lean condition thus over heating the heads?
Checked my mains and they are 135 which is pretty big. I have a thought though. About 10 months ago I changed out the needles to 50's from 75's. Could this have caused the float bowls to be almost drained at full throttle and cause a lean condition thus over heating the heads?
1977 Bus with Sunroof - "Lucky '77"
2000cc Type IV w/Dual Weber 36s,
Aircooled.net SVDA w/Compufire,
Redline Weber Fuel Pump,
Holley Regulator,
Half Ass Brush & Roller Rustoleum Paint Job,
Incomplete Custom Interior,
Dual Batteries,
Crunched Slider Door.
------------------------------------------------------
- Amskeptic
- IAC "Help Desk"
- Status: Offline
Re: Oil in the #4 combustion chamber!
Needles? Numbered why?Sluggo wrote:Went on a three hour each way camping trip this weekend. Lot's of hills. Ran like a champ the entire time. Still not even one drop of oil under the engine. The highest temp I saw was 455. Usually ran between 410 & 440 up hills. 375 to 410 on flat land. About 325 at idle.
Checked my mains and they are 135 which is pretty big. I have a thought though. About 10 months ago I changed out the needles to 50's from 75's. Could this have caused the float bowls to be almost drained at full throttle and cause a lean condition thus over heating the heads?
Most freshly overhauled engines run hotter with new rings and bearings, etc, but you just have new heads, right?
Colin
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles
- Sluggo
- Wishin' I was Fishin'
- Location: Portland, Or.
- Contact:
- Status: Offline
Re: Oil in the #4 combustion chamber!
Same heads. 3/4 side was rebuilt. Needles numbered as to how quickly they let fuel into the bowl. Read somewhere that Busses with Weber IDFs need 50's and that 75's were too big. I had 75's so I thought it might help prevent overflow/overfill.Amskeptic wrote:Needles? Numbered why?
Most freshly overhauled engines run hotter with new rings and bearings, etc, but you just have new heads, right?
Colin
1977 Bus with Sunroof - "Lucky '77"
2000cc Type IV w/Dual Weber 36s,
Aircooled.net SVDA w/Compufire,
Redline Weber Fuel Pump,
Holley Regulator,
Half Ass Brush & Roller Rustoleum Paint Job,
Incomplete Custom Interior,
Dual Batteries,
Crunched Slider Door.
------------------------------------------------------
- Amskeptic
- IAC "Help Desk"
- Status: Offline
Re: Oil in the #4 combustion chamber!
But level is determined by the float adjustment, right? So restricted fuel intake would give you a steadily developing lean-out on the road? It seems weird to me that they would try to meter fuel inlet volume, fricken Italians.Sluggo wrote: Needles numbered as to how quickly they let fuel into the bowl. Read somewhere that Busses with Weber IDFs need 50's and that 75's were too big. I had 75's so I thought it might help prevent overflow/overfill.
Colin?
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles
- Sluggo
- Wishin' I was Fishin'
- Location: Portland, Or.
- Contact:
- Status: Offline
Failed my DEQ & White Smoke.
Went to get my DEQ test today and fail the HC test. First time HC was 2001. Bumped up the idle and advanced the timing slightly then came back and got two tries. First was 1510 then 1591. Way over the 300 limit for HC. Then, when I got home, I saw lot's of white smoke coming out the tailpipe. Made sure the timing, idle & mixture were good but still got lot's of white smoke while idling and more while revving. Any clues? Just had a valve guide replaced and replace the P&Cs with good used ones.
1977 Bus with Sunroof - "Lucky '77"
2000cc Type IV w/Dual Weber 36s,
Aircooled.net SVDA w/Compufire,
Redline Weber Fuel Pump,
Holley Regulator,
Half Ass Brush & Roller Rustoleum Paint Job,
Incomplete Custom Interior,
Dual Batteries,
Crunched Slider Door.
------------------------------------------------------
- Amskeptic
- IAC "Help Desk"
- Status: Offline
Re: Failed my DEQ & White Smoke.
Did you smell the smoke? Lots of white is usually a blown head gasket allowing antifreeze into the combustion chambers. That would be a problem in an air-cooled bus.Sluggo wrote:Went to get my DEQ test today and fail the HC test. First time HC was 2001. Bumped up the idle and advanced the timing slightly then came back and got two tries. First was 1510 then 1591. Way over the 300 limit for HC. Then, when I got home, I saw lot's of white smoke coming out the tailpipe. Made sure the timing, idle & mixture were good but still got lot's of white smoke while idling and more while revving. Any clues? Just had a valve guide replaced and replace the P&Cs with good used ones.
White smoke in an air-cooled engine is insanely insanely rich UNburned fuel.
You have got to diagnose this thing. White smoke? Is it idling smooth or is there a miss? Dead cylinder? Did you do the pump-the-brake-pedal outside of the testing station to see where your mixture was? No sense in blowing money. I do that test to make sure my mixture is correctly lean. If the idle *ever* went up when I pumped the brake pedal, I would just drive past the station and adjust. Those aftermarket carbs suck. Period.
BobD - 78 Bus . . . 112,730 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles
Chloe - 70 bus . . . 217,593 miles
Naranja - 77 Westy . . . 142,970 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . . 55,600 miles
Alexus - 91 Lexus LS400 . . . 96,675 miles