best way to wallow out hole on exhaust manifold

Moderators: Amskeptic, Sluggo

User avatar
sgkent
Addicted!
Posts: 290
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2009 10:11 pm
Location: Citrus Heights CA (near Sacramento)
Status: Offline

Re: best way to wallow out hole on exhaust manifold

Post by sgkent » Sat Jul 22, 2017 12:21 pm

Latest post of the previous page:

the studs should not come out when you remove it. Only the nuts need to come off. Why you are missing a stud I don't quite understand. Enjoy your trip. you can use a piece of fuel line to listen for where the exhaust leak actually is before you start pulling things off.
Thank You -

Merlin The Wrench

Machine Work/Shop Recommendations: http://kentcomputer.com/77VW/machinework.pdf

Pointers on rebuilding an engine: http://kentcomputer.com/77VW/rebuilding_a_vw_engine.pdf

TrollFromDownBelow
IAC Addict!
Posts: 1083
Joined: Sun Aug 13, 2006 10:15 am
Location: Metro Detroit
Status: Offline

Re: best way to wallow out hole on exhaust manifold

Post by TrollFromDownBelow » Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:04 pm

sgkent wrote:
Sat Jul 22, 2017 12:21 pm
the studs should not come out when you remove it. Only the nuts need to come off. Why you are missing a stud I don't quite understand. Enjoy your trip. you can use a piece of fuel line to listen for where the exhaust leak actually is before you start pulling things off.
I'm missing a stud because the stud boss broke...there is nothing to drill/tap into...that's on the left head. Right head has some funky insert on the #2 cylinder that has a death grip on the spark plug that looks like it has 40k miles on it, but hey, it's still firing! Hence why I need new heads (which is a real shame, because the engine runs good, and the valves never get tight....only slightly loose between checks).

I have to remove the stud (right head) not so much to get the manifold off...but to get it back on again. When I drilled one of the tap holes (#2 cylinder) it was slightly of, so the angle it sticks out does not allow me to get the manifold on with all 4 studs in; only way I can do it is to screw out one stud, install the manifold, and then replace the stud. There's no question where the leak is coming from; I fire the engine up cold, and then I can feel it coming out of the #2 exhaust...you have about 30-60 seconds before things get too hot to stick your fingers up there.
1976 VW Bus aka tripod
FI ...8 completely solid lifters.... now it's both kinda noisy and leaky, but she sure runs good!
hambone wrote: There are those out there with no other aim but to bunch panties. It's like arguing with a pretzel.
::troll2::

TrollFromDownBelow
IAC Addict!
Posts: 1083
Joined: Sun Aug 13, 2006 10:15 am
Location: Metro Detroit
Status: Offline

Re: best way to wallow out hole on exhaust manifold

Post by TrollFromDownBelow » Mon Jul 24, 2017 9:16 am

I've put about 200 miles on it since installing the 4 new 10MM/8MM step studs. I've retorqued them twice, at approx 100 mile intervals. Starting off at 12 ft lbs, most of the nuts moved on the new studs. Expected this on the first check, not so much on the second. Will monitor, however, if they come loose on my camping trip next weekend, I'll have to assume the new studs are stripping out too. I have one more Hail Mary pass...bought some EZ-Lok thread inserts a couple of weeks ago. Will use these on any studs that are stripped/stripping out.

So before going through the process of removing the exhaust manifold, properly annealing the copper gaskets, filing down the manifold, etc, I'm going to wait and see if some of the studs are stripping out, and need to replace with inserts, because if I do, I will take the opportunity to do each of these exhaust leak avoidance measures.

Appreciate the support and guidance!
Mike
1976 VW Bus aka tripod
FI ...8 completely solid lifters.... now it's both kinda noisy and leaky, but she sure runs good!
hambone wrote: There are those out there with no other aim but to bunch panties. It's like arguing with a pretzel.
::troll2::

TrollFromDownBelow
IAC Addict!
Posts: 1083
Joined: Sun Aug 13, 2006 10:15 am
Location: Metro Detroit
Status: Offline

Re: best way to wallow out hole on exhaust manifold

Post by TrollFromDownBelow » Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:01 pm

Things seem to have taken a set...drove it to work the past few days (45 miles round trip each, all expressway) and things are getting quieter...gives me hope that the studs aren't stripping out (yet) . The true $64 question is, will the 9MM red loc-tite step stud give way to allow me to quiet down the right manifold.

Side note, my TSII seems to come loose every 1000 miles or so ... (the threads are a bit buggered...the original put up a valiant fight...remember Colin?). Used red loc-tite (notice a theme?) this time. Again, heads are toast (and the TSII is newer/new-ish). If it won't come out, I'll buy a new one when I replace the heads.

I'm guessing this thread with all my McGuiver-ish antics is giving some folks hives. But here's the deal; outside the heads' fatal metallurgical flaws, they perform awesomely! The engine performs great (at least when the TSII isn't loose). With all the questionable parts out there, why would I want to do a 'full rebuild' and not necessarily improve longevity or performance? I would like to stretch the time frame for these nicely performing OEM heads as long as possible. I was originally planning on installing new, or rebuilt heads, however, chatting with slowlane, he made a good point...how long is Len going to doing his craft before he throws in the towel? If I can get these heads to last another season, I could spring for a set, and use that as the basis of my rebuild.

Cheers,
Mike
1976 VW Bus aka tripod
FI ...8 completely solid lifters.... now it's both kinda noisy and leaky, but she sure runs good!
hambone wrote: There are those out there with no other aim but to bunch panties. It's like arguing with a pretzel.
::troll2::

User avatar
Amskeptic
IAC "Help Desk"
IAC "Help Desk"
Posts: 23055
Joined: Sun Apr 02, 2006 8:47 am
Status: Offline

Re: best way to wallow out hole on exhaust manifold

Post by Amskeptic » Tue Aug 01, 2017 10:41 am

TrollFromDownBelow wrote:
Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:01 pm
Things seem to have taken a set...

TSII seems to come loose every 1000 miles or so ... red loc-tite
They do that. If you keep them just-so torqued, the heating/cooling actually helps the copper seal as it ever so slightly chafes.

Red Loc-Tite turns into a lubricant at high temps + 350*. Don't use it in this application. Clean with mineral spirits and use a stripe of JB Weld in the threads. Just enough to hold things, but not too much to disassemble!
ColinInOregon
BobD - 1978 Bus . . . . . . . . . . .111,130 miles
Chloe - 1970 bus . . . . . . . . . . . 206,787 miles
Naranja - 1977 Westfalia . . . . . 91 414 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . 55,510 miles
Alexus - 1991 Lexus LS400 . . . 72,113 miles

Curtp07
Getting Hooked!
Posts: 78
Joined: Sat Jan 30, 2016 6:46 pm
Status: Offline

Re: best way to wallow out hole on exhaust manifold

Post by Curtp07 » Wed Aug 16, 2017 6:50 pm

I used a smoke generator,,,identified exactly where all the leaks were without contributing to my hearing loss...

User avatar
BusBassist
Getting Hooked!
Posts: 52
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2016 5:26 pm
Location: Rochester, NY
Status: Offline

Re: best way to wallow out hole on exhaust manifold

Post by BusBassist » Tue Feb 13, 2018 9:51 pm

I have a similar issue but instead of a loose stud, it's snapped off at the exhaust port. It appears that the logical solution is to remove the other nut , remove the exhaust, and then drill out the broken stud. However, I'm concerned that if I try to remove the other nut that the other stud my snap off as well. Is this a common problem that many air-cooled engine owners have to deal with?
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Late 73 Bay w/a transplanted 914 Engine.

User avatar
Amskeptic
IAC "Help Desk"
IAC "Help Desk"
Posts: 23055
Joined: Sun Apr 02, 2006 8:47 am
Status: Offline

Re: best way to wallow out hole on exhaust manifold

Post by Amskeptic » Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:22 pm

BusBassist wrote:
Tue Feb 13, 2018 9:51 pm
I have a similar issue but instead of a loose stud, it's snapped off at the exhaust port. It appears that the logical solution is to remove the other nut , remove the exhaust, and then drill out the broken stud. However, I'm concerned that if I try to remove the other nut that the other stud my snap off as well. Is this a common problem that many air-cooled engine owners have to deal with?
When you remove the exchanger, you will have plenty of stud sticking out. Hit it with Pb Blaster, tap the end of the stud with a hammer (primarily for vibration to work the PB Blaster up the thread) and do a couple of days of treatments before trying to remove the stud.

If the stud does snap off, dremel it smooth and flush with the head so you can center punch it exactly in the center of the stud, then drill up the center of the stud with your smallest bit, then go up one size at a time until you are at the diameter of the stud. Let the bit bite and stall, then try to reverse it out with the drill. I have never bothered with EZ outs because they can make life hell when you break them. So can broken drill bits so don't be distracted or rushed or violent. Be surgical and deliberate.
ColinWhoseExhaustHasBeenQuietFor300MilesSoFarOnTheWayToMiami,Yay
BobD - 1978 Bus . . . . . . . . . . .111,130 miles
Chloe - 1970 bus . . . . . . . . . . . 206,787 miles
Naranja - 1977 Westfalia . . . . . 91 414 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . 55,510 miles
Alexus - 1991 Lexus LS400 . . . 72,113 miles

User avatar
hippiewannabe
Addicted!
Posts: 452
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 7:50 pm
Status: Offline

Re: best way to wallow out hole on exhaust manifold

Post by hippiewannabe » Sun Mar 04, 2018 7:44 pm

Amskeptic wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:22 pm
BusBassist wrote:
Tue Feb 13, 2018 9:51 pm
I have a similar issue but instead of a loose stud, it's snapped off at the exhaust port. It appears that the logical solution is to remove the other nut , remove the exhaust, and then drill out the broken stud. However, I'm concerned that if I try to remove the other nut that the other stud my snap off as well. Is this a common problem that many air-cooled engine owners have to deal with?
When you remove the exchanger, you will have plenty of stud sticking out. Hit it with Pb Blaster, tap the end of the stud with a hammer (primarily for vibration to work the PB Blaster up the thread) and do a couple of days of treatments before trying to remove the stud.

If the stud does snap off, dremel it smooth and flush with the head so you can center punch it exactly in the center of the stud, then drill up the center of the stud with your smallest bit, then go up one size at a time until you are at the diameter of the stud. Let the bit bite and stall, then try to reverse it out with the drill. I have never bothered with EZ outs because they can make life hell when you break them. So can broken drill bits so don't be distracted or rushed or violent. Be surgical and deliberate.
ColinWhoseExhaustHasBeenQuietFor300MilesSoFarOnTheWayToMiami,Yay
One small tweak to this procedure is to use left-twist drill bits. All the torque you're putting on the stud will be in the correct direction, and as you go up in size you just might unscrew it.
The best time to plant a tree is twenty years ago. The next best time is today.

User avatar
tommu
Addicted!
Posts: 326
Joined: Wed Aug 12, 2015 8:37 pm
Location: Sunny Burbank
Status: Online

Re: best way to wallow out hole on exhaust manifold

Post by tommu » Wed Mar 07, 2018 9:50 am

hippiewannabe wrote:
Sun Mar 04, 2018 7:44 pm
Amskeptic wrote:
Wed Feb 14, 2018 10:22 pm
BusBassist wrote:
Tue Feb 13, 2018 9:51 pm
I have a similar issue but instead of a loose stud, it's snapped off at the exhaust port. It appears that the logical solution is to remove the other nut , remove the exhaust, and then drill out the broken stud. However, I'm concerned that if I try to remove the other nut that the other stud my snap off as well. Is this a common problem that many air-cooled engine owners have to deal with?
When you remove the exchanger, you will have plenty of stud sticking out. Hit it with Pb Blaster, tap the end of the stud with a hammer (primarily for vibration to work the PB Blaster up the thread) and do a couple of days of treatments before trying to remove the stud.

If the stud does snap off, dremel it smooth and flush with the head so you can center punch it exactly in the center of the stud, then drill up the center of the stud with your smallest bit, then go up one size at a time until you are at the diameter of the stud. Let the bit bite and stall, then try to reverse it out with the drill. I have never bothered with EZ outs because they can make life hell when you break them. So can broken drill bits so don't be distracted or rushed or violent. Be surgical and deliberate.
ColinWhoseExhaustHasBeenQuietFor300MilesSoFarOnTheWayToMiami,Yay
One small tweak to this procedure is to use left-twist drill bits. All the torque you're putting on the stud will be in the correct direction, and as you go up in size you just might unscrew it.
I took the destructive route when I removed a couple of stripped thread (not snapped) studs by using these:
http://www.sears.com/lisle-6-pc-stuck-b ... ockType=G1. They worked very quickly for me. Wonder if you have enough stud to use them too?

Post Reply

Return to “Engine”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests