stock bug questions from a stock bus family

Beetle, Karmann Ghia, Thing.

Moderators: Amskeptic, Sluggo

User avatar
asiab3
IAC Addict!
Location: San Diego, CA
Contact:
Status: Offline

Re: stock bug questions from a stock bus family

Post by asiab3 » Mon Dec 22, 2014 7:14 pm

Latest post of the previous page:

12/20 - early morning
Capering from Phoenix, Arizona!

Another interested buyer purchased an inspection of the car two weeks before I arrived. I found two perfect tie rods on the car. As it turns out, the bug doesn't have a steering damper. :lol: This inspector sounds like a winner.

The distributor (205M, vacuum advance only) had a blown vacuum can, so I popped my spare German 009 in. Of course I fell for the rookie maneuver of the 009 being clocked differently, so I had an embarrassing backfire starting it up... The accelerator pump seemed to be squirting gas out of the carb body, so I swapped in my spare H30/31. Bummer, because I LOVE the vacuum only distributor/ carb combo. I timed it and took it around the block and gave him cash. Spent some time changing fuel lines and inspecting other mechanicals. All the valves were around .002 to .003 lash, so I know the shop that maintains this bug is questionable. Also, they did the $300 "inspection" and didn't catch the blown distributor and gas leak. Good god...

Image
1969 bus, "Buddy."
100k miles with me.
279k miles on Earth.

User avatar
asiab3
IAC Addict!
Location: San Diego, CA
Contact:
Status: Offline

Re: stock bug questions from a stock bus family

Post by asiab3 » Mon Dec 22, 2014 7:16 pm

Back to Discount Tire twice... The new Nankangs shook SOOO bad above 50mph. Otherwise I'm en route! (Edit: they bent a rim the first time and added six weights on the inside that I couldn't see. SIX!

Image
1969 bus, "Buddy."
100k miles with me.
279k miles on Earth.

User avatar
asiab3
IAC Addict!
Location: San Diego, CA
Contact:
Status: Offline

Re: stock bug questions from a stock bus family

Post by asiab3 » Mon Dec 22, 2014 7:19 pm

My girlfriend who lives in Phoenix took the road picture. She was instrumental in this whole shebang, so Kate thanks again if you read this! She took me to the sellers house, helped me change the fuel lines, and spotted me for 20 miles or so to make sure I wasn't leaking, fuming, dripping, or having inaccurate speedometer readings. 8)

Image

And oh yeah.... I MADE IT!

At 9:47pm, I pulled in 13 minutes ahead of my deadline. Kept the surprise alive, and got 27-30mpg all the way home. Once I get a proper vacuum advance distributor and slow down from 72mph all the time I'm sure that will go up. The drive was literally identical to a modern car- get in and go. I could spend my whole life qualifying why I like these cars, but I'd rather fix and drive them.

Image

There's something about taking an engine that you help "bring to life" on a wild ride through some beautiful scenery that makes my face hurt from smiling.

Robbie

Image
1969 bus, "Buddy."
100k miles with me.
279k miles on Earth.

User avatar
asiab3
IAC Addict!
Location: San Diego, CA
Contact:
Status: Offline

Re: stock bug questions from a stock bus family

Post by asiab3 » Mon Dec 22, 2014 7:38 pm

So the triage went down like this:

Jack up car to inspect for rust.
Feel for wheel-bearing play.
Inspect electrical for hacks.
Pay the dude.

Then the fun started! The seller was a really nice guy, and I told him that I planned on doing a few hours of mechanical check-ups before hitting the road or calling a tow truck. He let me use his driveway, brought me some paper towels, and offered us coffee and dogs to play with during stress relief breaks.

Every press of the throttle gave a healthy squirt out the blanking plug on the back of the original German 30pict1 carb. Since I had a spare known-good H30/31 with me, I opted for a direct replacement rather than trying to hack a plug seal together. Like I mentioned above, the original 205M vacuum-only distributor would not move the points plate no matter how hard the carb pulled. Mouth-sucking my hardest suck couldn't move it either. In went a German 009 with a tear, with a promise to get my fresh 30pict3 and 205T in it as soon as I got home. While I had the carb off, I replaced every bit of rubber fuel line in the car. No grommet or metal line was to be found near the firewall, so I'm glad I brought some! The cool thing about this car is the division of responsibility; I work on it, but my dad finances it. It's a dream for someone like me who can easily blow a few hundred dollars on spare gaskets, seals, and doodads. (Plus my parents know how to do math, which means they'll always opt for the more expensive quality parts that last longer.)

This afternoon I got the rebuilt distributor on it, and even with the Brazillian carb the performance and driving experience is improved to borderline unrecognizable. I WISH I would have brought the spare with me, but I did have to fly out on late notice…

Work to be completed soon:
-The car had dealership AC from 1969, so the fan shroud has the 3-4 side fresh air hose routed up and around an empty compressor-shaped space. The heat output in the footwells is noticeably better on the passenger side, so I wonder if there is more cooling going to the cylinder heads/oil cooler on the driver's side? I have spare fan shrouds ready to go, both doghouse and non-doghouse, so I will be interested in researching temp trends that others have noticed with/without the AC hose reroute.

-The transaxle output shafts leak a little, so I'll be doing another seal replacement. I JUST did the ones in my bus, but I guess I couldn't get away that easy…

-I'd like to hook up the preheated air intake before presenting the car, so there will be a little less icing in the morning. Though the new distributor has essentially eliminated any hesitation.

-Something is squeaky in the right rear torsion setup. I'm fairly certain it's the spring plate bushings, so I'll be having fun there too.

-Do new rims hold up compared to the old ones? Or am I better off finding a used one and having it blasted and re-chromed?

Thanks for following,
Robbie
1969 bus, "Buddy."
100k miles with me.
279k miles on Earth.

User avatar
Bleyseng
IAC Addict!
Location: Seattle again
Contact:
Status: Offline

Re: stock bug questions from a stock bus family

Post by Bleyseng » Tue Dec 23, 2014 9:58 am

Great update! Glad you had a fun ride back home but I thought you were going to drive topless!
I hate Discount Tire as their monkeys destroy everything! I will never go there again especially with a set of Fuchs alloys as they destroyed a friend's 914 2.0L rims and wouldn't pay for the damage.
Geoff
77 Sage Green Westy- CS 2.0L-160,000 miles
70 Ghia vert, black, stock 1600SP,- 139,000 miles,
76 914 2.1L-Nepal Orange- 160,000+ miles
http://bleysengaway.blogspot.com/

User avatar
asiab3
IAC Addict!
Location: San Diego, CA
Contact:
Status: Offline

Re: stock bug questions from a stock bus family

Post by asiab3 » Tue Dec 23, 2014 12:36 pm

Discount Tire has been great to me in the past, and they were the only ones who could get the stock size tires for me in time for Christmas. My family all voted against the whitewalls, so Cokers will have to wait… DC let me pull the car in, I removed the hubcaps, and dictated the inflation pressures and tightening torques. One monkey gave me the legal "we can't put a tire on the road with less than 30psi" spiel, so I told him 20-30 again. When he declined I gave up, told him to do it his way, and told him I would just deflate it in the parking lot. When I pulled it out, I found 20-30 as requested… :)

I went top up because a few of the sane members of TS bug forum remarked on seeing hotter CHTs with the top down. It really does interrupt the airflow, and the early convertible deck lid, (complete with engine rain guard,) doesn't inspire a free-flowing path for the fan air intake. Also it got chilly around 9pm! I have since taken some (beautifully tuned-up) topless joyrides around our canyon, and I REALLY love the sound of that oversized sewing mating ticking away only a few feet from my head.
1969 bus, "Buddy."
100k miles with me.
279k miles on Earth.

User avatar
wcfvw69
Old School!
Status: Offline

Re: stock bug questions from a stock bus family

Post by wcfvw69 » Tue Dec 23, 2014 5:39 pm

I never drive with my top up in my 69 convertible. I personally have not experienced any increased temperatures with the top down. I've driven my vert in 100 degrees down the freeway for 30 miles and had 210 oil temps (though i do have the rain tray removed). The engine fan is pulling air in from the louvers and shouldn't be impacted by the disrupted air stream from the top being down.

I remember watching Myth Busters as they did their test on whether a tail gate being up or down impacted MPG. It didn't which surprised me. I've heard that from other places as well.

Just my opinion and experiences.
1970 Westfalia bus. Stock 1776 dual port type 1 engine. Restored German Solex 34-3. Restored 205Q distributor, restored to factory appearance engine.

User avatar
asiab3
IAC Addict!
Location: San Diego, CA
Contact:
Status: Offline

Re: stock bug questions from a stock bus family

Post by asiab3 » Tue Dec 23, 2014 6:40 pm

Thanks for the observations. I could NOT get my infared gun to read more than 200* oil. Crankcase at cam gear, sump plate, under distributor, under generator, and below fuel pump were always at or right below 200*. A gauge would be different, but I think I mentioned that my bus (doghouse 1600dp) is always 220*-230* in those spots.

If there was some sort of weird low pressure system being created above the vents, then the fan would absolutely be affected. This car will be a weekend putterer for the next few years, so we're not concerned. We'll have a tennis ball in the boot in case we have any Phoenix summer trips planned.

I'm really having a tough time getting used to "jack up the car" being the first step in every procedure… Clutch cable adjustments, steering box adjustments, CV torquing, and more are minor chores now as opposed to simple pleasures.
1969 bus, "Buddy."
100k miles with me.
279k miles on Earth.

User avatar
wcfvw69
Old School!
Status: Offline

Re: stock bug questions from a stock bus family

Post by wcfvw69 » Tue Dec 23, 2014 8:40 pm

asiab3 wrote:Thanks for the observations. I could NOT get my infared gun to read more than 200* oil. Crankcase at cam gear, sump plate, under distributor, under generator, and below fuel pump were always at or right below 200*. A gauge would be different, but I think I mentioned that my bus (doghouse 1600dp) is always 220*-230* in those spots.
I don't have gauges either. I use my infared gun as well. I've noticed in my short bus ownership time that the 1776 in the bus does runs just a bit hotter than either of my bugs. The previous owner installed an exterior oil cooler and oil filter when the engine was built. It does seem to keep the oil temps down as I checked the oil temp after a 10 mile run on the freeway this past summer and it was at 220 degrees which I was fine with.
asiab3 wrote:If there was some sort of weird low pressure system being created above the vents, then the fan would absolutely be affected. This car will be a weekend putterer for the next few years, so we're not concerned. We'll have a tennis ball in the boot in case we have any Phoenix summer trips planned.
You might be right though I haven't experienced this nor have I ever read about it in 10 years on The Samba, in the 300 "my bug is overheating" threads posted each year on that site.
asiab3 wrote:I'm really having a tough time getting used to "jack up the car" being the first step in every procedure… Clutch cable adjustments, steering box adjustments, CV torquing, and more are minor chores now as opposed to simple pleasure
Too funny. I experienced just the opposite experience when I bought my bus. I kept thinking, "hey, this is nice to be able to crawl under a VW without a jack!" Even pulling the engine without having the bus way up in the air to clear the body work is a pleasure.
1970 Westfalia bus. Stock 1776 dual port type 1 engine. Restored German Solex 34-3. Restored 205Q distributor, restored to factory appearance engine.

User avatar
Amskeptic
IAC "Help Desk"
IAC "Help Desk"
Status: Offline

Re: stock bug questions from a stock bus family

Post by Amskeptic » Wed Dec 24, 2014 7:22 am

asiab3 wrote: There's something about taking an engine that you help "bring to life" on a wild ride through some beautiful scenery that makes my face hurt from smiling.
Robbie
Ahh . . . it makes me just want to hit the road again. . . . oh, wait a minute, I AM on the road.
Raining like hell, too. But the little Chloe air-cooled engine is just whiling away the miles back there from Pensacola to Atlanta this morning. Still on Gauge Vacation and loving it!

That is a lovely little bug. Enjoy!
Colin
BobD - 1978 Bus . . . . . . . . . . .111,130 miles
Chloe - 1970 bus . . . . . . . . . . . 206,787 miles
Naranja - 1977 Westfalia . . . . . 93,996 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . 55,510 miles
Alexus - 1991 Lexus LS400 . . . 72,113 miles

User avatar
asiab3
IAC Addict!
Location: San Diego, CA
Contact:
Status: Offline

Re: stock bug questions from a stock bus family

Post by asiab3 » Wed Dec 24, 2014 9:47 am

amskeptic wrote:Still on Gauge Vacation and loving it!
After 8 hours in the bug, I found myself scanning the bus gauges much less frequently.

Until I found 442* up a nice hill. :pukeright:

And the bug engine is quiet and smooth too! We accidentally hit 60-something in 3rd gear before my rev-limiting rotor kicked in. I didn't foresee myself being the first one to use that……

Robbie
1969 bus, "Buddy."
100k miles with me.
279k miles on Earth.

User avatar
asiab3
IAC Addict!
Location: San Diego, CA
Contact:
Status: Offline

Re: stock bug questions from a stock bus family

Post by asiab3 » Mon Dec 29, 2014 12:40 am

Long story short: Gen light on, and I walked mom through replacing the old brushes that I knew were pretty worn down. Turns out, mom took the springs off the generator too, so I pulled the whole thing out of the car for reassembly.

But the light refused to go out with GOOD brushes FULLY seated against a SMOOTH AND CLEAN commutator!

Then Dad drops a bomb on me: "Yeah the light has been on since the DMV inspector asked to see the vin number under the back seat." :roll:

Oops. Should have checked this first. Sure enough, the #61 Idiot Light wire terminal was bent and hanging off from when they gorilla-fisted the seat back in. Pinched the connector a little tighter, de-oxed all the connectors on the voltage regulator, and hit the road. No more light for this car. :lol:

So what if the bus generator is easier to remove in situ; the non-doghouse fan shroud in this bug is a piece of cake to raise for access. I had a really nice time bonding with this car; I feel like we know each other now. Shifts are smoother, turns are groovier, and one of the window whistles stopped. Thanks car.

Image

I was then rewarded with a trip through Angeles National Forest with the top down and heater levers standing at strict attention. What a beautiful day for an air-cooled adventure through some intense scenery with an incredible human being of a copilot.

Robbie

Image
1969 bus, "Buddy."
100k miles with me.
279k miles on Earth.

User avatar
Amskeptic
IAC "Help Desk"
IAC "Help Desk"
Status: Offline

Re: stock bug questions from a stock bus family

Post by Amskeptic » Tue Dec 30, 2014 10:55 am

asiab3 wrote:Long story short:
Gen light on,
#61 Idiot Light wire hanging
No more light.
smoother
Now it reads like a haiku.

How is intrinsic engine balance/fan - generator balance?
Colin
BobD - 1978 Bus . . . . . . . . . . .111,130 miles
Chloe - 1970 bus . . . . . . . . . . . 206,787 miles
Naranja - 1977 Westfalia . . . . . 93,996 miles
Pluck - 1973 Squareback . . . . . 55,510 miles
Alexus - 1991 Lexus LS400 . . . 72,113 miles

User avatar
asiab3
IAC Addict!
Location: San Diego, CA
Contact:
Status: Offline

Re: stock bug questions from a stock bus family

Post by asiab3 » Tue Dec 30, 2014 12:47 pm

Amskeptic wrote:
asiab3 wrote:Long story short:
Gen light on,
#61 Idiot Light wire hanging
No more light.
smoother
Now it reads like a haiku.

How is intrinsic engine balance/fan - generator balance?
Colin
The entire rotating assembly has always been quite good. Twice now I have hit the rev-limiting rotor (4500) in a spirited third-gear freeway prelude. I have to get my parents double-clutch downshifting in my bus; the bug engine is so smooth, it is hard to hear when we get the correct RPM in neutral. The bus vibrates, shimmies, and shakes enough to make "RPM pitch" matching easy.

I did not take a quick run without the fan belt; more pressing matters occurred, like spark plug wires that fell out of the bakelite connectors, a non-vented gas cap with a non-vented gas tank :scratch: , and a decklid with 3.5 of 4 stripped mounting screws.

Robbie
1969 bus, "Buddy."
100k miles with me.
279k miles on Earth.

Post Reply