Republican Scorched Earth Policies

[Amskeptic]

But "controlling carbon dioxide somehow"? Who are the players? What have they planned? It has to be beyond idle barstool guesswork.

The players are the IPCC, various academics, jury-rigged boards of institutes, government(s), investment funds.

Do they have half the focus of the anti-global warming crowd status-quo making billions in the current unsustainable model? Hell no.

Besides all that, read my last point (which you edited in a typical misquote):

3. there's a third option which DOES NOT control carbon dioxide somehow

Typical contradiction of logic in the post-normal science generation. THE WHOLE PURPOSE OF GLOBAL WARMING CAMPAIGN IS CURTAILING CO2 EMISSIONS. What don't you get about it NOW? You used to live by the creed. Now it is inconvenient to admit, and you toss it in the trash to squabble with me. Who's the real plonker utterly devoid of independent original logic?

This is bizarre. How did I misquote you? I merely chose not to address your every point. "Typical contradiction of logic"??

No, this is the same sort of catastrophicism that greeted safety and fuel economy standards in the automobile industry. It was exactly your sort of thinking that finished off the hide-bound American car manufacturers and allowed Toyota and Honda to leapfrog ahead of us. Innovativeness will do that.
We could spank the Chinese with carbon sequestration/conversion technology if we would just invest and innovate. Make money! Like creative Republicans (an oxymoron)!

I do not want you on my team leading into the future, turk.
Colin

Where's the factual basis of any of that? Bad. Fail. Ideologue.

WHAT? Do you not read? Do you not remember how American automobile manufacturers wailed and cried foul every time we increased economy standards and tightened emissions? They claimed a loss of jobs and "loss of performance that Americans want", but finally they were shamed into actually doing some real R&D and now we have American cars that outperform anything from the pre-emissions days with twice the economy. Facts, turk. It is all in the specifications/sales records. You may bravely retort "Bad. Fail. Ideologue.", but you are hopelessly behind the curve on this one.
Oy, Colin

[turk]

Yeah, you edited your quote of me. After 3. my point is deleted and you jumped right to my conclusion, making it appear that was what I typed. So, not "bizarre". And all this about American cars is fine and dandy, but I think your original point implied foreign makes were superior because they voluntarily care more about emissions. Thus, the point being all we have to do is care more and we should "leap-frog" them in superiority of auto-making among other industries. No factual basis to that idea did I see presented. On the other hand my point is clear and irrefutable: GLOBAL WARMING CAMPAIGN is about CO2 CONTROL, bottom line.

[glasseye]

I have been advised by council to desist from this fruitless, useless, circular babble.

I hereby absent myself before I go totally batshit.

[turk]

When you ask a "question" and I answer it straight off, what's the point in playing around for 4 pages claiming you "wish, just once, I'd answer a question"? Seems very batshit to me. Go catch some moths.

[turk]

This is bizarre. How did I misquote you? I merely chose not to address your every point. "Typical contradiction of logic"??

Let me clarify it. This is what I actually typed:

3. there's a third option which DOES NOT control carbon dioxide somehow

You quoted it but left that whole sentence out even though you left the number 3. there, and then pasted my conclusion in place of it.
now as for the importance of that point. GE maybe you will get it too. IF IT'S NOT CO2 THAT THEY ARE CONCERNED WITH AND AFTER, THEN WHAT THE HELL ARE THEY AFTER? Thus the hypothetical "third way", NOT curtailing CO2 "somehow", but yet still averting "global warming". I know that's a lot for some people to chew.. . So, THAT's what the "typical contradiction of logic" is. I was being ironic. GET IT?

[ruckman101]

No, I don't get it. I think you missed Colin's point. He was pointed out that corporations cry wolf over impacted profits at every suggestion of evolving technologies. Safety, mileage, disclosure, pollution. Implementing safety standards will destroy the industry, improving fuel efficiency will destroy the industry, weaning off of oil will destroy the industry, dragging heels, but then other corporations in other countries adapt and actually surpass our "innovation".

Personally, the water in the hot tub is too hot for me, I must not be a frog. And if I manage to get out without being pulled back in by my bathing companions, I must not be a crab, either. And no, I don't think you are right turk, no matter how many times you tell us you are.


neal

[ruckman101]

Shock Doctrine, Naomi Klein. Republicans want one national government, nothing state or local. One elite republic, a corporate plutocracy. Your town privatized.


neal

[turk]

No, I don't get it. I think you missed Colin's point. He was pointed out that corporations cry wolf over impacted profits at every suggestion of evolving technologies. Safety, mileage, disclosure, pollution. Implementing safety standards will destroy the industry, improving fuel efficiency will destroy the industry, weaning off of oil will destroy the industry, dragging heels, but then other corporations in other countries adapt and actually surpass our "innovation".

Personally, the water in the hot tub is too hot for me, I must not be a frog. And if I manage to get out without being pulled back in by my bathing companions, I must not be a crab, either. And no, I don't think you are right turk, no matter how many times you tell us you are.


neal

I got it fine. I don't think Toyota or Hyundai or Honda voluntarily "adapted". I bet they were "forced" just like the big three. This is not the point. The point is what I posted is absolutely, irrefutably the case: global warming campaign has a bottom line: control carbon. It isn't "utter devoid of factual basis". On the contrary, it's painfully obvious. So, I don't care much if you "don't think I'm right" about that, but I'm pointing it out very plainly for anyone anyway. Simple. Fact.

[ruckman101]

Koch brothers talking points, no matter how much you protest, filtered down to you. Corporations shoving the costs to the public sector. Privatize profits, socialize the negative costs of the consequences. The biggest polluter in the world doesn't want to accept the costs of that pollution. We should in their book. Complex, Lies.

Climate change is a socialist plot. Cling to your conspiracy.


neal

[turk]

Okaaaaay! It's all a conspiracy then.

[ruckman101]

The first step to recovery is recognizing your addiction.


neal

[turk]

I have to say I'm not the one bringin' up conspiracies. We had this talk before, probably more than once.

[ruckman101]

So let me get this straight, the auto companies that responded to concerns with innovation, developing safer more fuel efficient models profited, while the auto companies who resisted, denying the validity of those concerns almost went under into bankruptcy.


Why does that resonate so much with me. Oh yeah, energy companies.

When you live it, it isn't a conspiracy. I guess I have to hold off congratulating you on taking your first step to recovery. Who really shot JFK?


neal

[chitwnvw]

Oh, it's a mystery to me
We have a greed with which we have agreed
And you think you have to want more than you need
Until you have it all you won't be free

Society, you're a crazy breed
Hope you're not lonely without me...

When you want more than you have
You think you need...
And when you think more than you want
Your thoughts begin to bleed
I think I need to find a bigger place
Because when you have more than you think
You need more space

Society, you're a crazy breed
Hope you're not lonely without me...
Society, crazy indeed
Hope you're not lonely without me...

There's those thinking, more-or-less, less is more
But if less is more, how you keeping score?
Means for every point you make, your level drops
Kinda like you're starting from the top
You can't do that...

Society, you're a crazy breed
Hope you're not lonely without me...
Society, crazy indeed
Hope you're not lonely without me...

Society, have mercy on me
Hope you're not angry if I disagree...
Society, crazy indeed
Hope you're not lonely without me...

[airkooledchris]

why did I know that after 19 pages it absolutely HAD to come back around to some global warming crap?


not even the road runner was this stubborn