Warming Not Cooling <8-O

[Amskeptic]

I saw a report on the Weather Channel last night. They know weather.
They also know climate. Not being the most politically skewed channel, they polled 3,476 international climatologists with Doctorates in their chosen fields.

Yes....global warming is a scientifically observable phenomenon.....No
90%..........................................................................10%

[turk]

I'd lean toward counting myself in the 90%. But that doesn't mean we did it, or that we can do anything about it. There's the rub. I think that poll would come out differently among experts.

[ruckman101]

3,476 international climatologists with Doctorates in their chosen fields aren't experts?


neal

[turk]

But what did they agree on? Not that the warming is unprecedented, or caused by humans, just that it is observed; secondly, they didn't all agree that we could do something to stop it, or if stopping it is even desirable. I don't see the claim that it is bad in the post. Anyway, yeah, so what? We are in the Holocene Epoch of the Quaternary Period, following the Wisconsin Glaciation. Everyone knows that.

[ruckman101]

It was simply a poll. Of experts whose expertise was questioned by the suggestion that the poll would have turned out differently if presented to experts.


neal

[turk]

Wha? Huh? So? I agree with what the basic statement was. There has been warming overall. It's common knowledge and I assent. It's not alarming or unprecedented. It's high school science.

[ruckman101]

I was just curious why you felt "...that poll would come out differently among experts." when it was a poll of experts. Confused me.


neal

[turk]

Cool man. I just don't think jumpin' to conclusions is necessary when all is well weather-wise. What a topic. I heard Krugman recently "weighed in" on this again, saying it's "obvious" something is awry. Yikes. These pundits get paid good dinero for scaring the populace, when it's actually nothing remarkable in the context of actual climatology, geology and shit, just existing as humans with a blue planet called earth. I can't stand that idiocy thrown around the media like so much propaganda disguised as common sense. Takes a country boy to see the BS I guess. That's me. Just a Hoosier with some horse sense. LOL.

[ruckman101]

Uh-huh.


neal

[turk]

Uh-huh.


neal

Yeah

[grandfatherjim]

OK, so there is global warming; no one is disagreeing.
Would you agree that humans are polluting the atmosphere more now than ever? It seems like it.

It looks like you (turk) are saying that our present level of pollution is not enough to get alarmed about. If so, then could you produce the "opinion of experts" on how much is too much?
If it's hundreds of years away, let's say, is it your contention that we may as well continue as we are until we actually do reach the point where we are contributing to global warming?

Or am I reading you all wrong and are you really saying that air pollution and global warming have no connection whatsoever?

Jim

[turk]

Here's a question for you Grandpa: All the progeny you sire, how'd ya manage to do it, and retire, and keep warm in the Great White North, and they prolly have an even better life than you did, with a brighter future to boot? Or are you really worried they're gonna have a buncha babies who will in turn sire a nother bunch, all of which will go out and buy 1959 Cadillacs. Why conflate the two unless you are robbin Pete to pay Paul for some reason, likely that humans are too dumb to do something for a real reason, so you make up a proxy one.

[grandfatherjim]

I really don't understand your last sentence; could you re-phrase please?
And can you answer my question with an answer, rather than another question?
Thanks.

Well, I don't think I have to describe how to sire progeny.
Or, how I managed to retire - cause I still work.

I was starting to see your point in all this, even though I didn't agree with it. But I thought you had a reason for your position at least.
But now you are implying that the next generation has a brighter future than ours? By that one statement, you have caused my opinion to revert right back to where it was at the beginning, which is that you're just in big time denial. You like researching stuff on the net - check out "normalcy bias".

Check out how the US dollar is no longer going to be the reference currency of the world. Check how if every US taxpayer was taxed at 100%, it wouldn't be enough to cancel the deficit. Check how the stock market is tracking how it performed in the 1930s - right before a big crash. Your once great country is in the biggest financial trouble it has ever seen - check out the real economic future of the US, and then tell me the next generation will be better off. It's true, my family is in Canada, but we will feel the effects here very strongly as well.

Or.... tell me there is no hard evidence. And tell me again in a year. Normalcy bias.

So, back to my question - are you really saying that air pollution and global warming have no connection whatsoever?

Jim

[turk]

How in hell is the government of the U.S. going to enforce stabilizing the climate somehow. That is the question. If carbon dioxide is a pollutant, then what will be targeted to reduce the carbon dioxide level in the earth's atmosphere, to theoretically stabilize a climate.

Do you understand the point above regarding "pollution". Yeah, pollution is bad. We get it.
Here's another Jim: When all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail.

[Amskeptic]

How in hell is the government of the U.S. going to enforce stabilizing the climate somehow. That is the question. If carbon dioxide is a pollutant, then what will be targeted to reduce the carbon dioxide level in the earth's atmosphere, to theoretically stabilize a climate.

Look at how other countries are responding to this issue. They aren't all Al Gore clones. The steps we can take to reduce greenhouse gases (including carbon dioxide) are many and varied and there are creative minds putting their energies to discovering new ways to make energy. Look at our enormous successes so far, look at how we cleaned up automobile exhaust and improved fuel economy AND performance. The status-quo of the time said it couldn't be done.
Colin